Annotative Scaling someone help.

[AutoDac12]

So in searching for a few days what Ive found is that most people dont know annotative and how to use it. So I couldnt find an answer. 

but basically I have a very simple drawing and Im new to this so bare with me although Ive tried everything. 

model space simple draw evertyhing 1 to 1 full size. 

I then select viewport and chose the size I want to view the piece Ive drawn. simple.

model space has a selector bottom right for annotative scale for your items although alot of people think its for your drawing objects. 

either way I chose the item text or demensions and select the annotative scale I want to use which matches my viewport scale. 

my text height for all my selections is 1/8. my annotative is clicked on and everything is set up. 

and bam my text shrinks like no bodies business. 

now ive read someone said well just increase your text height. well I can do that to 1/2" and its fine but is that what we are supposed to do? 

I will attach my drawing and its at 1/8 paper text height. Im working in archtect units. 

[AutoDac12]

Sorry my scales were messed up in the first file I fixed them. I had been playing with it. But here are the viewports with the correct scales. 

[nestly2]

Wecome to the Autodesk forums.

Your dimension isn't really "shrinking" it's just not scaling because it only has one annotative scale assigned to it.  Try adding 6" = 1'-0" to the dimension and then reselect the scale in the scale list at the bottom to update the VP.  Your dimension text and arrows should now be the same size in both viewports.

You may also look in the Help files for ANNOALLVISIBLE and ANNOAUTOSCALE.  The former controls whether annotative object are hidden if they don't have a scale assigned that matches the VP scale, and the latter controls whether annotative scales are automatically added when you change the VP scale.

Here's a Youtube that explains Annotative dimensions pretty well  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcNk1-i_cuk

[AutoDac12]

thank you for the response. did you see my second drawing attachment. I thought I had included both scales in the scale list. 

I watched that video like 4 times and several others lol. I just cant see why when I pick the text and add it its become so small you cant see it without zooming in

is that normal? or are we supposed to be able to see it from regular view. 

I know all about anno disappearing if it has the wrong scale per viewport etc. My main concern is that it become so small. is this normal? Can you fix my drawing and reattach it so i can see what Im doing wrong. 

Should I not have to change the text height in properties. I assume this is the same as paper text height under annotative properties when reference text, demensions etc. We want  to keep that paper text height at whatever we want to print at correct. ie. 1/8. is that what most people use? or 3/32? 

Thank you for your responses 

[nestly2]

You need to add the  6"=1'-0" annotative scale to the DIMENSION, not the scale list,  Annotative objects only scale automatically when they have an annotative scale assigned to them that matches the VP scale.  Your dimension only has 1''0" = 1'-0" assigned to it, so that's the only scale that it's going to display properly. 

There are several ways to assign multiple scales to objects.  In the animation below, I use the Properties Palette, but other methods include ANNOAUTOSCALE and manually adding scales to a selection set as demonstrated at 1:30 to 2:30 in the youtube previously provided.

edit incorrect time in youtube

[AutoDac12]

you are a genius for posting a cool video now let me watch it. brb. ok gotcha I thought my second drawing post included both scales but I see how you added them. I added them by highlighting both and add/delete scales very simple. 

but my questions is.. when you get done.. see how the one box on the right, its dems are so small you cant see them or read them unless you zoom in.. 

is that normal? 

like if you zoom out as if you were looking at the whole sheet in layout paper space. should you be able to read all your dems and text?  w/o zooming in? 

when I say text I mean like all the text everything is just very small is that the way it is or should we be able to read all the text and dems in layout/paper space

[AutoDac12]

this is what I see when its done. 

[nestly2]

In your attachment, the dimension text now appears to be the same size in both the left and the right viewport. 

Your paper size is "D"  (34x22) so it appears to me that your dimension text is about the correct size (1/8") on that size paper.  Is that still not what you want? 

[AutoDac12]

hi thanks, 

it should be set to 17x11. yes did you see my prnt scrn attachment. all the text and dem is to small to read when looking at it in regular view. w/o zooming in is this normal? 

or should be able to read it before zooming in.. and will it print out readable? is there any way to see how it will acutually print out other than plot preview? which shows basically the same thing. not the 1/8" style that you would actually see when you print am i correct? 

am I expecting to much from autocad to say ok here are my annotatives and here is my vp scale and bam i should be able to read it? autocad wont do that for us? it will scale it but depending on the vp scale it will be tiny and unreadable in a regular view w/o zooming?

[nestly2]

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AutoDac12 wrote:

am I expecting to much from autocad to say ok here are my annotatives and here is my vp scale and bam i should be able to read it? autocad wont do that for us? it will scale it but depending on the vp scale it will be tiny and unreadable in a regular view w/o zooming?

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On paper, no, that's not expecting too much,  On screen, yes (unless your screen is as wide as the paper you've specified  (34 inches in this case)  Neither depend on the VP scale if the annotative objects are assigned the correct scales, and according to your attachment, you it appears that both viewports are displaying the text at 1/8" relative to a 34x17 sheet.

If you're supposed to be using 17x11 paper, then change your pagelayout and your titleblock to AnsiB (17x11) and your text will instantly appear twice as large on screen while viewing the entire sheet compared to an AnsiD sheet.

[AutoDac12]

yeah I know I changed it. The file i sent wasnt what I have I guess. now here is a new one for multi leaders. 

I cant even see my rinky dink multi leaders in model space or paper space is this normal. 

i have custom vp 2" =1 and my mult leaders set up like normal anno. 1/8 height etc. can you help me with this one. 

My multileaders are set to circle and the numbered 1 and 2. if you zoom in ten millions times you can see them? is this normal what am I doing wrong. 

A cool video would nice nice if you can fix it so I can see the numbers. but you dont have to.

[nestly2]

Your Multileader content is scaled 1/8.  Scaling should always be "1" for everything when using Annotative objects... AutoCAD will do the rest.

Go into the Mleader style and change scaling back to "1" on the "Content tab".  When you save and close the Mleader style dialog the callout circles will be the correct size.

Note... that drawing is also on AnsiD paper, so if that's not the correct size paper, all your features will appear to be too small.

[AutoDac12]

Thanks maybe im a newb but although it does say ansiD i modified it and should be set to 17xll ansib. the ansid was just the original template I opened up I thought. under page set up manager. 

I set the content to 1" or 1 and nothing happend please see attached. 

never mind you were right but i had to delete my old mleader and make new ones. with the new scale. maybe cause i didnt have it highlighted when I did it. but its getting bigger now and thats a good thing..

is there anyway to get this lay out sheet to fit the screen full size? you know that whay when you are looking at layout or paper space that.. there is no grey background to be seen but only white sheet. 

[nestly2]

I did another (longer) video based on your last drawing, and while watching may help understand some of what's going on in your drawing, my advice is to start over with a new drawing from scratch. The default Annotative dimstyle and the default mleader style should work well for any size paper and any VP scale, don't change them.  If you need mleaders with callouts and bubbles, copy the default annotative mleader style and make changes there so if something goes awry, you have the default to compare.  Don't start with a Layout/titleblock that's the wrong size.  Create a new layout tab and set it up for the paper size you intend to output too.  You'll run into far fewer problems starting off right rather than trying to resize a layout created for an entirely different purpose. 

Regarding the MLeader scale, I'm not exactly sure why changing the scale from 1/8  to 1 wasn't reflected in the drawing, it should have been, so there's something else going on there but I didn't see it readily.

Anyway, my advice is to get a book and read through the chapters on layouts and plotting.  Layouts and scaling isn't difficult after you understand the basics of how AutoCAD layouts and scaling works, but it's not intuitive either and not easily picked up without some structured teaching.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDvHMulvj_Y

[AutoDac12]

I see good catch. no autocad is really simple the problem is most people teaching it or talking about it are giving out wrong information. I read in a fourm to use that fit to paper deal if your sheet doesnt match your template title block. I have not got to that section yet to really get into it so good catch. 

I did finally get those mleaders to change. 

when you say leave that at defaults what do you mean? 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78tu9RUdWkE  4:49. is where I changed someo of the defaults. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SihSQByuD6I    9:14 also here. 

both of these are the two best videos on youtube. but I find it funny everyone that does a vid on annotation only does a simple 1:2 or 2:1 

and conviently their scale size has already been decided but they never tell you how they decided their scale size. But its all the same. 

well this is why i changed some of the defaults to have the text match 1/8. the only issues I had was when I clicked fit to paper. That screwed my drawing. 

Ill start over and get the layout set up and then do the scaling. 

Are they doing anything wrong in the above videos setting it up the annotative properties?  Please let me know

do you normally use templates or create your own title blocks? 

[nestly2]

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AutoDac12 wrote:

when you say leave that at defaults what do you mean? 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78tu9RUdWkE  4:49. is where I changed someo of the defaults. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SihSQByuD6I    9:14 also here. 

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 What I meant was to avoid making significant changes to the default dimension and multileader styles, instead create a new dimstyle or mleader style and name it so you can easily identify what it is.  I do see where they changed the MLeader arrow size at 4:49 so mleader arrows are the same as dimension arrows, and this is fine but I think they must have changed them once before because they should have been the same to begin with.

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AutoDac12 wrote:

....but I find it funny everyone that does a vid on annotation only does a simple 1:2 or 2:1 

and conviently their scale size has already been decided but they never tell you how they decided their scale size. But its all the same. 

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 Figuring out which scale is needed to display the model and details at is bit tricky.  Typically, I try to use one of the included scales as those are generally "standard" scales that go back to the days of hand drafting.  You just have to look at your model and picture which areas can be shown at the main scale, and which areas will need it's own VP for a detail.  From there, I create my Viewports in the Layout and then simply pick a scale from the list that will display that area of the drawing with enough detail.  After you create a few drawings, you'll get a feel for what the scale needs to be even before you create the VP's

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AutoDac12 wrote:

Are they doing anything wrong in the above videos setting it up the annotative properties?  Please let me know

do you normally use templates or create your own title blocks? 

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 I only watched the first, but everything seemed correct to me.  The only difference is that I don't add my dimensions and MLeaders in Modelspace, I add them from within the viewports in the Layout so I don't have to constantly change the Annotation scale (when you activate the VP, any annotative object that are added  automatically inherit the correct scale)

[AutoDac12]

nestly

Here is how you fix the layout if its to big rather than making a new drawing. 

I did this and got it lined up but need to get the print area opened up to get it off the title block any ideas. I dont have full bleed in my american scale. I tried full expand ansi b and it kicks the title block off the page. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMGObXyvxfE

check it out let me know

[nestly2]

I definely do not endorse that method.  It might not be "too bad" when using a titleblock designed for 8.5x11, but if you try to scale an "A" size titleblock to "B" paper size, the titleblock boxes and the titleblock text will be huge when printed. Secondly, he didn't scale the titleblock accurately, he scaled it from "about here" to "about there"  It's sloppy at best, and it will cause inaccurate plots at worst.  Lastly, don't scale anything to "fit the paper" unless you simply don't care about the drawing scale, because the scaling won't be accurate. 

Again, if you're plotting 17x11, find a titleblock designed for 17x11 (ANSIB), insert it into a pagesetup for 17x11, and plot the Layout at 1:1.  That's always going to be my advice  😉

[AutoDac12]

Dont you like how I make it harder than normal to make a simple drawing but yeah so I got her all tightened up see attached and I just used the 

full bleed method to pop the print scale out. but yeah its about here and there but close enough. Yeah I dont like the method but I thought it was cool. 

so my next question is. do you know where I can find a template for ansi B title block 17x11. 

thanks. 

[AutoDac12]

do you alwasy put your dims and text in paper space or what. some people do some dont. what is the best way.