Vault not replacing local copies?

[Anonymous]

Hey guys/gals,

I've got a question for you, and please tell me I've done something wrong in my setup and not that Vault has a serious flaw causing data to be overwritten.... 😞

Anyways, I am working with a company where there's about 5 CAD Users working on the same project. We're using Inventor Suite 2010 with Vault Manufacturing 2010. I've occasionally had complaints about work that was done by a user has seemingly 'disappeared' when they open the file from the Vault. I finally managed to get one user to demonstrate this to me recently. He browsed through Vault Explorer, opened a drawing file and noticed a couple of sheets were missing that he knew had already been done by another user. He noticed if he un-did the check out (with the "Replace Local Copies" option checked) and re-opened the file from Vault, it had the sheets that time.

The next time this happened to him (about two files later that night), I right clicked (in Vault) on the version in the History tab that was now the previous version (his current, checked out version was considered the latest). The DWF that opened had the two sheets. The IDW that he opened did not.

I then checked his Vault options for any dialogue or prompt suppression. The only prompt he had set to suppress was the "properties are out of date" where he's selected "Never Prompt" and "Yes to All". He had no other suppressions set.

So, we deleted his local copy, and then opened from Vault and it was fine.

So why on earth, if his local is different, did Vault not warn him? At the very least, why did it not overwrite his copy with the most recent, as he was actually opening from Vault and not local?

We've noticed a few files where this has happened, and it doesn't appear localized to one machine. Obviously, this is a major concern that files in the Vault are not be properly updated locally on open. Instead, Vault is opting to use the local, out-of-date copy and change the Vaulted copy!

Also, I've done a few renames and moves in Vault. However, those changes also have been lost on many of the files when another user accesses any files relating to those renames/moves, therefore causing MANY issues. I believe it to be the same issue.

Of course, we're now trying to religilously clean out our local Vault workspaces regularly, but the potential for data lost is very concerning.

Is there something very basic that I'm missing here?

Thanks!

Scott

[olearya]

Hi Scott,

This seems to be a procedural issue as you suggest with your designers manipulating their local copies instead of using the latest Vault copies.

There is a number of reasons why we retain local copies of files but are aware of the issues related to working on older copies and have implemented a number of tools to remove the likelihood of users checking in incorrect files.

1. Close and delete files on check-in: this option available on check-in allows users to remove the existing copy of the file once they are done with it.

2. Workspace Sync: Vault Manufacturing allows users to scan their local workspaces to update and/or remove out of date design files (Managed and unmanaged)

3. Check-out rules: any out of date files will NOT permit check-out operations preventing users from modifying the wrong version of vaulted files

The most important thing the users can do here though if there are rapid changes being made to the designs the team is working on is simply to NOT open the local copy but open the drawings and assemblies directly from Vault.

Using "Open from Vault" command will ensure they always have the latest "checked in" version of the file for modification.

Moving and renaming files within the Vault will also require this same dilligence - moving a file in the Vault will create a redirection link in the assemblies and drawings but does NOT move local copies of the data - these need to be removed before or after the move command as do renamed files (Workspace Sync is great again for this).

In terms of file status icons this is a different matter - I would suggest opening a support case with your reseller if the file status icons in Inventor are not reporting the file status correctly, this is a little curious.

Hope this helps,

Allan (Autodesk)

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the reply, Allan, I appreciate the depth of information that you took the time to present here!

I agree that the majority of the time it most likely is a result of user procedures causing similar errors.

Unfortunately, I witnessed the user open a file directly from the Vault, and yet it did NOT give him the latest checked in copy. Instead, it reverted to the local copy on his machine some how. I'm not sure how this happens.

If we're the only ones this sort of thing has every happened to with Vault, we will try and catch a repeatable case that we can log with Autodesk then. I was hoping, however, that there was a switch/setting somewhere that I was unaware of that would alleviate this.

Thanks again, Allan!

Scott

[Anonymous]

Ok, this is getting even more bizarre. Now we've had a case where I opened a file FROM VAULT EXPLORER and noticed a part was missing in an assembly. I discussed this with the modeler who built the assembly and he assured me he had put it in. I then checked previous versions, and it was indeed there. So, I did a "Get Revision" on the assembly and the piece appeared.

Note that four of the five pieces that he had placed in this assembly before checking it into the Vault DID appear, only one did not. So this is now becoming a mixture of local copy AND vaulted copy!

This is NOT a procedure error. This is a blatant VAULT error.

Does anyone have any sort of insight into this? I will log this as a defect with Autodesk, but as its not predictable as to when this might happen, I'm not sure what good that might do.

We're starting to see this more and more, and its becoming VERY disconcerting that we cannot trust the data that Vault is giving us. We're over-writing too much work here!

Scott

[olearya]

Hi Scott,

Creating a case with Autodesk support is probably the next step here - this behavior certainly is a little odd and should be investigated further. It is of huge advantage if you can recreate this behavior using the same steps with the same dataset.

Allan (Autodesk)

[Anonymous]

Actually, I noticed on Thursday that we are beyond our SQL Express database limit size (limit is 2GB, we were sitting at 2.3GB). We had bought a new server with full SQL, but weren't able to upload the data to it yet. So after seeing that, I didn't allow anybody to work over the weekend and got all our data into the new Vault.

Therefore, as this database limit was exceeded, I'm hoping that was the cause of the majority of our "wierd" Vault issues (which I've seen in the past). If it still happens with our new Vault, then I know we've got other major concerns...

Thanks, all!

Scott