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upside down diffusers

29 REPLIES 29
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Message 1 of 30
Anonymous
2896 Views, 29 Replies

upside down diffusers

Ok, before you laugh, keep in mind I am electrical by trade. I am trying to use the Square Supply Diffuser - Hosted family in a Mechanical Ceiling view. When I place the diffuser it comes in on the floor, upside down. So I go to the floor plan, select the item and change it's elevation but it is still upside down. I'm trying to place a diffuser that is hosted by the ceiling grid.

Now you may laugh.
29 REPLIES 29
Message 2 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

The issue of it being placed on the floor is how Revit Systems (this
version) does it - we hope for more in the next version. When I placed the
diffuser it came in correctly. See attached.

David Haynes
Ideate, Inc.
www.ideateinc.com



wrote in message news:5256019@discussion.autodesk.com...
Ok, before you laugh, keep in mind I am electrical by trade. I am trying
to use the Square Supply Diffuser - Hosted family in a Mechanical Ceiling
view. When I place the diffuser it comes in on the floor, upside down. So
I go to the floor plan, select the item and change it's elevation but it is
still upside down. I'm trying to place a diffuser that is hosted by the
ceiling grid.

Now you may laugh.
Message 3 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Thanks.
What does it look like when you open the family itself? When I open the family it is upside down. See attached.
Message 4 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Is your project location set to somewhere in Australia by any chance? Your diffusers could be configured for global orientation to the wrong coordinate system.

(OK, done laughing now 🙂

This is actually an easy mistake to make when placing hosted families.

It sounds like you may not be using the correct "placement mode" for what you are trying to accomplish. When you select the "Air terminal" button on the design bar and then choose "Square Supply Diffuser - Hosted: " then 3 buttons should appear on the options bar, next to the properties button (you may have to hover over the active view to make these buttons appear). The 3 buttons are for:

1. Place on Vertical Face - this mode will place the diffuser on the Host Face that you select, oriented vertically, at the defualt elevation of the diffuser (4ft in this case). This mode is intended primarily for placement on a wall. Note: if you select the ceiling grid as the host, the difusser will be placed oriented vertically at the (x,y) location you selected on the host(ceiling), but at the default elevation of the diffuser family.

2. Place on face - This mode will place the diffuser directly on the host face at the the location that you select. Default elevation is not applicable in this case.

3. Place on Work Plane - This mode will place the diffuser on the current work plane at the (x,y) location that you select.


I suspect that you probably used Mode 3 (Place on Work Plane), and that your work plane is located at floor level. The easiest way to place the diffuser on the ceiling grid is to use mode 2 (Place on Face).

Hope this helps.

Jason
Message 5 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

mmm.........kangaroo burgers.......

To place it on a face (the ceiling) I need to be in the 3d view instead of the Mechanical Ceiling Plan view. And yes, still upside down. Also, this type of family is not ceiling hosted, so if the grid moves the diffusers do not. I've taken to creating my own from a ceiling hosted family template.

I'm considering putting ceiliing hosted air terminal families on the wish list, but by the time they come around I will probably have made all that I need. Guess that's the trouble with a software release with very little content.

Thanks for your help!
Message 6 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

You should still put it on the wishlist, and thru Autodesk's feedback page.
The more it is mentioned, the sooner it gets implemented (hopefully! ).

--
R. Robert Bell


wrote in message news:5256551@discussion.autodesk.com...
mmm.........kangaroo burgers.......

To place it on a face (the ceiling) I need to be in the 3d view instead of
the Mechanical Ceiling Plan view. And yes, still upside down. Also, this
type of family is not ceiling hosted, so if the grid moves the diffusers do
not. I've taken to creating my own from a ceiling hosted family template.

I'm considering putting ceiliing hosted air terminal families on the wish
list, but by the time they come around I will probably have made all that I
need. Guess that's the trouble with a software release with very little
content.

Thanks for your help!
Message 7 of 30
sinisia
in reply to: Anonymous

The main reason for the current default diffusers being work plane hosted instead of clg hosted is that currently, clg hosted won't work if the arch model with the grids is a linked file. Clg hosted would only work if arch and MEP are sharing the same model using worksets. Work plane hosted will operate the same in both cases, whether the grid is in a linked file or not. Wishlist items that would meet both sets of requirements is if either clg hosted worked on linked file grids and/or workplane hosted recognized the clg grids

PS: These are on the wishlist already, but your wishes reinforce that. It's actually the same behavior in both Building and Systems.
Message 8 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Thanks Tony.

Any reason why they are upside down? Or is my family just screwed up?
Message 9 of 30
sinisia
in reply to: Anonymous

If you attach the family or log it with Product Support then we can have a look at it. I'm guessing that either the workplane in the Family has xyz coordinates flipped or maybe you accidentally created it upside down in the Family.
Message 10 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

This forum won't allow me to attach the family.
I will check the xyz coords. It is an "out of the box" family, not one I created.
Message 11 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Zip the file. Size is limited, and so are extensions.

--
R. Robert Bell


wrote in message news:5256776@discussion.autodesk.com...
This forum won't allow me to attach the family.
I will check the xyz coords. It is an "out of the box" family, not one I
created.
Message 12 of 30
sinisia
in reply to: Anonymous

Could be our error in the Family then. What's the name of the rfa file? We can check it on our side in the original.
Message 13 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Here is a zip of the family.
Square Supply Diffuser - Hosted.rfa
Message 14 of 30
sinisia
in reply to: Anonymous

Yup...looks like our bug. It's upside down in my install build too. We'll log that one and get it fixed. Sorry for the trouble.

Thanks Don
Message 15 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

CORRECTION:

Sorry about my initial reply - what I described is accurate, BUT not for the R1 released version ;). It seems that a limitation of R1 is that the ceiling grid is not recognized as an eligible face to host a face-based diffuser. This may be addressed in the next release.

As far as the problem with the diffuser being upside down, it seems that when the face-based diffuser is hosted by a ceiling (or a by a work-plane that is defined by a ceiling) the orientation of the diffuser is rotated upside down from it's defined orientation within the family - which is apparently why the diffuser is defined "upside down" within the family editor. It appears that when the diffuser is placed on any surface or plane not related to a ceiling, it will come in upside down in the project (which is "right-side" up in the family editor).

I looked at this a bit in R1 now and found a potential solution to the problem using R1 content.

Open ceilng plan mech view

Tools>Work Plane>Set Work Plane...

Pick a Plane -> select the ceiling grid

Insert the diffuser using the placement mode "Place on Work Plane".

This should insert the diffuser at the the elevation of the ceiling. When the ceiling elevation is changed, the diffuser will stay connected to the work-plane, which stays connected to the ceiling.

This solution requires one extra step (setting the work plane to the the ceiling grid prior to placement of diffusers), but all should be good after that, and the diffuser content that shipped with R1 should (hopefully) be able to do what you are trying to accomplish.

Please let us know if you still are having troubles.

Thanks.

Jason Bishop, PE
________________________________________
SQA Engineer
Building Solutions Division
Revit Systems QA
Message 16 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Jason,
You were right. The ceiling grid is an eligible face, IF you are working in the 3d view. My main concern isn't with change in the grid elevation. I'm more interested in the diffuser aligning with the grid, which this particular family won't do. So I will just have to create my own diffusers for now. Thanks for your input, you've given me a better understanding of hosted families.
Message 17 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Tony,
Thanks for looking into that. It's no trouble, I'm learning a lot here. Bob asked me to mention to you that this may be a good interoperability point. Looking at how the software is used by multi-discipline firms (like ours) as opposed to consultants. We are preparing a project template that will utilize worksets across the disciplines so that is what started my exploration of how the mechanical systems function.
Message 18 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Don,

Have you tried using the align command and locking the diffusers to the vertical and horizontal grid lines? I did this and am able to use the R1 content and product to maintian the diffuser's alignment with the grid.

By the way, I actually was NOT able to have the ceiling as an eligible face in R1, even in 3D view (not sure how you were able to accomplish this?). My initial reply was regarding working with a current in-house build - I am able to place the diffuser on the ceiling in PLAN view (something which cannot be done in release 1).

Regards,

Jason

...another interesting nuance... if you actually select the entire ceiling grid and move it (use tab key until entire ceiling grid is red - not just one grid line) then the diffusers will maintain their location with respect to the grid, i.e they will remain "attached" to the grid, even if you have not locked them 🙂

Cheers. Message was edited by: Jason Bishop
Message 19 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Jason,
I'm not sure I'd want to go through the aligning process every time I place a diffuser, especially since there are families that will do it automatically.

Not sure how I did it either. Our goofy architects must have made the grid in some weird way 🙂 The attached picture shows placing (upside down) in a 3d view.

I am using Build 20060619_2300
Message 20 of 30
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Good point 🙂 Thanks Don for all of the feedback and insight. Your comments are very much appreciated.

Jason

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