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cannot close opening for gambrel shed dormer

12 REPLIES 12
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Message 1 of 13
kwg06516
1222 Views, 12 Replies

cannot close opening for gambrel shed dormer

I'm new to Revit and watched every tutorial on roofs and dormers I could find and I can't find a solution.  I have a shed dormer coplanar with the top chord of a gambrel roof.  When I try to use the dormer tool it will not let me select the shed dormer roof to close the loop.  There are no tools beyond picking appropriate edges/planes so I can't close it any other way than picking appropriate planes.  Why doesn't it see this roof plane as appropriate?  

 

Both the gambrel roof and the shed roof were created from extrusion since I couldn't figure out how to create a sloped roof from the dormer walls that was coplanar with the top chord of the gambrel without tedious manual calculations of wall heights or levels.

 

I've tried hiding/isolating uninvolved elements for easy picking and attaching/unattaching walls to roofs.

 

I also tried joining the shed to the gambrel which while successful in and of itself did nothing to help the dormer tool cut the lower chord for the dormer walls.

 

I am aware there are manual methods to cut the roof and modify the wall profiles but I'm afraid that these methods will not join the elements in way that will produce a correct section or framing detail.

 


AutoCAD 2010


AutoCAD 2015


Revit 2015

12 REPLIES 12
Message 2 of 13
Alfredo_Medina
in reply to: kwg06516

One possible solution is: 3 roof elements, by footprint, like this:

 

12-8-2012 4-19-36 PM.jpg


Alfredo Medina _________________________________________________________________ ______
Licensed Architect (Florida) | Freelance Instructor | Autodesk Expert Elite (on Revit) | Profile on Linkedin
Message 3 of 13
kwg06516
in reply to: kwg06516

I suppose I can give that a try.  It probably makes more sense from a construction standpoint since the rafters of the dormer are continuous to the top ridge.  I'm looking forward to how revit will generate the detail for where the main roof changes pitch, these being done as two roofs now.

 

Any suggestions on how I unite them?

 

 


AutoCAD 2010


AutoCAD 2015


Revit 2015

Message 4 of 13
kwg06516
in reply to: kwg06516

But before I do that I'd like to know what I did wrong in the first place.  I made a copy of the project and reduced it to the elements involved.  Can someone tell me why I can't get it to accept the shed as a dormer?

 


AutoCAD 2010


AutoCAD 2015


Revit 2015

Message 5 of 13
Alfredo_Medina
in reply to: kwg06516

I don't see problems in your model. I would just do a couple of things:

  • Join geometry, to glue the pieces together.
  • Vertical opening on the roof by extrusion, to cut a hole for the room on the second floor.

Alfredo Medina _________________________________________________________________ ______
Licensed Architect (Florida) | Freelance Instructor | Autodesk Expert Elite (on Revit) | Profile on Linkedin
Message 6 of 13
loboarch
in reply to: kwg06516

The shed roof elements need to be first joined to the gambrel roof.  Once the roof join has happened you can use the dormer opening tool to cut the opening in the gambrel roof.

 

eidt: Alfredo beat me to the answer.  Probably because I had to wait for a file upgrade since I happened to have a development build running on my machine at the moment.  Smiley Happy



Jeff Hanson
Principal Content Experience Designer
Revit Help |
Message 7 of 13
kwg06516
in reply to: loboarch

Your suggestions aren't helpful if I can't pick that fourth edge!

 

Why can't I pick it?  Even in Wireframe Revit refuses to let me pick it!  Is this some shortcomming of LT?

 


AutoCAD 2010


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Revit 2015

Message 8 of 13
kwg06516
in reply to: kwg06516

Look, it's letting me pick a wall surface no where near the roof but not the roof itself!

 

dormerfail2.PNG

 


AutoCAD 2010


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Revit 2015

Message 9 of 13
loboarch
in reply to: kwg06516

If by 4th edge you mean the one where the shed roof meets the gambrel, you need to join the 2 roofs first.  Otherwise Revit does not really "see" the edge where they meet.



Jeff Hanson
Principal Content Experience Designer
Revit Help |
Message 10 of 13
kwg06516
in reply to: loboarch

Still not letting me do it.  Are any of you able to do it with the project I posted the way Jeff is suggesting?  Because I can't make it work.  I've wasted enough time and money on this problem.  I'll scratch build it by Alfredo's method and screw using the dormer tool because it's apparently not up to the task.

 

 


AutoCAD 2010


AutoCAD 2015


Revit 2015

Message 11 of 13
loboarch
in reply to: kwg06516

I was able to do it with the project you posted.  I tested before I posted.  I tested tried with a development version of Revit I had open at the time.  I did not realize you are using Revit LT, I will test with that to see if there is a difference, but there should not be.  I just don't have a current version of LT installed.  I am installing now to test.



Jeff Hanson
Principal Content Experience Designer
Revit Help |
Message 12 of 13
kwg06516
in reply to: Alfredo_Medina

Architecturally the slope defined edge method is the most sound in my opinion since it best reflects the methods of construction.  The shed rafters would be continuous to the ridge and the dormer side walls would bear on trimmer rafters of the gambrel.  Why Revit doesn't handle this cleanly I don't know, but it's beginnning to make sense why most of the beginner projects look like post modern Neutra.

 

Thank you, Alfredo.

 

Now if I can find a way to trim this horizontal eave element to the appropriate surfaces.

success.PNG

 

 


AutoCAD 2010


AutoCAD 2015


Revit 2015

Message 13 of 13
loboarch
in reply to: loboarch


@loboarch wrote:

I was able to do it with the project you posted.  I tested before I posted.  I tested tried with a development version of Revit I had open at the time.  I did not realize you are using Revit LT, I will test with that to see if there is a difference, but there should not be.  I just don't have a current version of LT installed.  I am installing now to test.


I did not get Revit LT finished install on Monday before I left and then was out of the office yesterday.  I checked this today in Revit LT and your dataset.  I was able to cut a dormer, I just neede to make sure the shed roof and the walls of the dormer were joined to the gambrel roof.  You need to have a clear edge between elements in order for the dormer tool to pick up the edge.  You can simply have geometry run past/through each other.  You need to join/attach to the adjacent elements or Revit does not "see" the edges.



Jeff Hanson
Principal Content Experience Designer
Revit Help |

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