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Active Contributor
nicole.jones
Posts: 31
Registered: ‎06-26-2007

Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

32 Views, 17 Replies
08-20-2009 10:52 PM
I'm trying to import .3ds models into Max 2010 Design with some odd results. The 3ds model has a lot of odd unnessary faces. I have a very simple Arch&Design material applied to it. Other materials exhibit the same odd behaviour in the viewports & when rendered.

I've tried adjusting the normals with no effect.

Unfortunately, I don't have any choice about how the original .3ds models are created. I'm stuck working with this format.

I'd appreciate any suggestions.

Cheers.

Attachment is not working. What it should show is a number of boxes broken up into triangles of black & white. Sorry, not very meaningful without the attachment.

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Moderator
Steve_Curley
Posts: 18,572
Registered: ‎08-07-2007

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

08-21-2009 01:48 AM in reply to: nicole.jones
Zip the file first (not .rar or any other alternative) then it should attach. Oh, and do NOT preview once you've attached the file - submit immediately.

Max 4.2 through 2015 (SP1), Composite 2014.
Win7Pro x64 (SP1). i5-3570K @ 4.4GHz, 8Gb Ram, DX11.
nVidia GTX760 (2GB) (Driver 335.23).

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Active Contributor
nicole.jones
Posts: 31
Registered: ‎06-26-2007

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

08-24-2009 04:50 PM in reply to: nicole.jones
Thanks, Steve. It was the previewing the attachment causing the problem. Near impossible to offer any suggestions when no one can see the issue. Thx.
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Moderator
Steve_Curley
Posts: 18,572
Registered: ‎08-07-2007

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

08-25-2009 02:36 AM in reply to: nicole.jones
Not too easy to diagnose even with it.

Can you zip one of these .3ds files and post it? (copyright permitting, of course). My guess is that it's either a) options when importing, b) options used when originally exported or c) they are just iffy models and you'll have to do some work on them to make them usable.

Max 4.2 through 2015 (SP1), Composite 2014.
Win7Pro x64 (SP1). i5-3570K @ 4.4GHz, 8Gb Ram, DX11.
nVidia GTX760 (2GB) (Driver 335.23).

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Distinguished Contributor
camedeck
Posts: 3,180
Registered: ‎02-23-2005

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

08-25-2009 01:31 PM in reply to: nicole.jones
It looks like flipped faces, and/or coplanar faces. In Poly mode in the Editable Mesh, theres a checkbox for Show Normals. A blue line will show which direction the normals are facing for any selected polys. Useful to see where there are problems like this. Try it and see how things look.

You might also want to try adding an Edit Mesh, then deleting or moving some faces to check for coplanar surfaces. You can delete the modifier without accidentally screwing up the original mesh.
Dell T7610 workstation
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Moderator
ekahennequet
Posts: 2,038
Registered: ‎05-29-2006

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

08-25-2009 02:38 PM in reply to: nicole.jones
Chris and Steve gave good tips in this thread also. Maybe it has something to do with object being too big, too small. or too far away.

http://area.autodesk.com/forum/autodesk-3ds-max/3ds-max-through-2008/very-odd-display-problem-in-vie...

Edit: Chris/Steve, I forget if the scale/unit issue affect rendered images. Perhaps it is because of flipped normals.
E. K. Anna Hennequet
a.k.a "ekah"
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Moderator
Steve_Curley
Posts: 18,572
Registered: ‎08-07-2007

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

08-25-2009 03:19 PM in reply to: nicole.jones
Looking at the image they do look, as Chris suggested, flipped, rather than the "messy" artifacts you get with coincident polys caused by an incorrect scale.

AFAICR the "artifact" type of problem normally only affects the viewports, not the render. Distance from the origin frequently shows up in the user having difficulty snapping, object flying out of the viewport with the smallest of mouse movements and so on.

Would be useful to have the Max scene and, if possible, the .3ds - that way we should be able to determine the cause of the problem.

Max 4.2 through 2015 (SP1), Composite 2014.
Win7Pro x64 (SP1). i5-3570K @ 4.4GHz, 8Gb Ram, DX11.
nVidia GTX760 (2GB) (Driver 335.23).

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Active Contributor
nicole.jones
Posts: 31
Registered: ‎06-26-2007

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

09-01-2009 06:46 PM in reply to: nicole.jones
Thanks to everyone for their thoughts.

After a bit more investigation it seems that the problem only occurs when I'm using an Arch&Design material. Even a Standard material with 2-sided left unchecked works perfectly. Weird?

Unfortunately, I seem to have dozens of Arch&Design materials in my library. Any thoughts on forcing 2-sided rendering on this type of material? It doesn't have any effect when checking "Force 2-sided" in the options within the Render Setup area.

I've also attached the .3ds model in case anyone has any bright ideas on fixing the model itself.

Thx again.

shareit.zip

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Moderator
Steve_Curley
Posts: 18,572
Registered: ‎08-07-2007

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

09-02-2009 03:36 AM in reply to: nicole.jones
I don't think this is a Material problem, more an issue with the underlying mesh.

I have a feeling I've seen that model, or one very similar, before - with similar problems.

Basically it's not a model - it's a collection of 54 objects which looks like a model.
Import the .3ds into a new, clean scene.
There are 4 Omni lights at the same point in space which is pretty pointless - delete them out of the way.
Viewport Properties, 2 default lights.
Select "scx_shar 1B" which is the the upper left cupboard door and "hide unselected".
Get rid of the material by typing "$.material=undefined" (without the quotes) into the Maxscript Listener.
Object Properties | Backface Cull (on/checked), orbit around the object and you'll see that the object does not become invisible when looking at the backs of the polys. Very strange because you don't even see the black backface rather than nothing (which I think is what you're seeing when originally imported). If you create a normal Plane object, convert to Mesh, Backface Cull, you will see what should happen.
Problem is that pretty much every other face seems to react as if it were flipped, but it isn't, which is why you're seeing black triangles.

Put bluntly, that model is a mess and you'll spend a lot of time trying to fix it. Would be good to see some other opinions before you start shouting at the author of the model though ;-)


Max 4.2 through 2015 (SP1), Composite 2014.
Win7Pro x64 (SP1). i5-3570K @ 4.4GHz, 8Gb Ram, DX11.
nVidia GTX760 (2GB) (Driver 335.23).

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Valued Contributor
RUSSELLWELCH
Posts: 87
Registered: ‎04-10-2010

Re: Importing .3ds with Odd Faces

09-03-2009 02:15 PM in reply to: nicole.jones
I had the same problem, yesterday, while I was working on a vehicle model that was created by someone else. The alternating black and white triangles only appeared on the "side trim" and the "bumpers." The problem turned out to be "co-planer" faces. The trim and bumpers were the exact same size and were stacked on top of each other, occupying the same space. I fixed it by moving each respective car object a very small distance. Both matching and identically shaped peices were a part of the model. I was only able to identify the problem after going into sub-object mode and selecting the "Element" level and then selecting the offending areas. If anybody needs to see a test rendering or screen shots, let me know.
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