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iCopy position problem

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Message 1 of 20
Mike686
2093 Views, 19 Replies

iCopy position problem

hi, i'm trying to make some panel using iCopy

i've see this video on youTube  http://youtu.be/uRR4xsev8SU

i've follow the technique to build my panel

in the exemple i'm posting i did'nt use the icopy with the frame generator as it shows in this video

when the layout i use to place my panel is on the xy plan it works fine but if i want to insert it on another plane the panel is all wrong or it doesnt show at all..

 

i want to know what i'm doing wrong or at least how to make this work...

 

i work in the curtain wall buisness and i want to use to icopy tool to make my glass and aluminium panel..

 

can someone give me a little help with that...

i'm joinning with this message a pack and go,

 

Product Design Suite 2017
Tags (3)
19 REPLIES 19
Message 2 of 20
NicolasXu
in reply to: Mike686

Hi Mike686,

 

I took a quick look for the test dataset. One of the possible cause is that the base sketch is created on XY plane, so it will always be landing on XY plane in other iCopy instances. That means the sketch will turn to a line if inserting iCopy on YZ plane.

 

You may try create a work plane through the 3 work points, and then create the Sketch on the workplane.

 

Not sure if you have went through the tutorials, but it's worth to take a look:

http://wikihelp.autodesk.com/Inventor/enu/2013/Help/0126-Tutorial126/0127-Inventor127/0490-Use_iCop4...

http://wikihelp.autodesk.com/Inventor/enu/2013/Help/0126-Tutorial126/0127-Inventor127/0481-iCopy%3a_...

 

Thanks,

Nicolas



Nicolas Xu
Sr. SQA Eng.
Fusion 360 Quality Assurance Team
Autodesk, Inc.
Message 3 of 20
gboshko
in reply to: NicolasXu

HI MIKE,

I'M HAVING THE SAME PROBLEM. WERE YOU ABLE TO RESOLVE?

GEORGE

Message 4 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: gboshko

no, i'm still stuck..i've found another tutorial on augi but when i try to make my own the same plan problem keeps comming back

its really frustrating cuz they make it look so easy in the tutorial...

my bet is there something that i dont set adapatative or vice versa

if you solve the problem please let me know

i'll do the same

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 5 of 20
gboshko
in reply to: Mike686

Hi mike,

Somebody from Augi got back to me. I’ll be uploading a data set at your post tomorrow for him to look at. Hopefully we will have an answer shortly.

Regards,

George

Message 6 of 20
NicolasXu
in reply to: gboshko

Hi Mike,

 

I cannot access Youtube, but based on your model, I’d suggest another way to achieve the requirement. Please check attached dataset to get the idea. The iCopy Template is located under “.\iCopyTest\iCopy_Template”. In this case, I directly use the points in sketch, but not workpoints, which may easier to understand.

 

Anyway, please post any follow-up questions if you have. And here are some tips for building an iCopy Template:

  • iCopy Template is the key assembly, which contains at least an adaptive layout part. You need align origin between the layout part (remove the grounded status if exists) and the top assembly.
  • The layout part should contain an adaptive sketch, and other features/work geometries/sketches are based on this adaptive sketch. During creating the adaptive sketch, you need consider which geometries will be driven by adaptive, and add necessary constraints and dimension. Note: Do not add driving dimension if the dimension may change by adaptive.
  • You can carry out parameters into iCopy definition for better controls of flexibility.

Capture.PNG

Thanks,



Nicolas Xu
Sr. SQA Eng.
Fusion 360 Quality Assurance Team
Autodesk, Inc.
Message 7 of 20
gboshko
in reply to: Mike686

Thank you Nicolas,

I have been grounding my parts and using line geometry instead of points.

I will give your method a try.

Appreciate,

George.

Message 8 of 20
gboshko
in reply to: Mike686

Nicolas,

Problem solved!

Your dataset really helped me out.

In my layout sketch I had one corner constrained to the origin. This is not correct if the intent is to use the i-copy on other work planes.

Thanks again.

Message 9 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: NicolasXu

Nicolas thanks for the reponse, i will try it

and see if everything work for me

 

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 10 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: Mike686

hi Nicolas, i've use the tips you gave me and it solve a lot of problem

i still have one problem i can seem to correct..

i'm posting the layout part and the assembly

the problem is with the body i did with the sweep command

when insert it with icopy everything work fine

but when i change a dimension in the target assembly, i lost the body (solid 4) in my icopy

the other solid bodies are ok

 

can you check it out and see if you can find what i've done wrong??

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 11 of 20
NicolasXu
in reply to: Mike686

Hi Mike,

 

I took a look the dataset, it seems there are some problems during update. The projected geometry in Sketch4 and Sketch6 lost reference, which results in sweep failure.

 

I'd say what you have done is correct, but the update have some issues. I will report this issue into our internal tracking system.

 

As a workaround for handling such issue, you may definitely add sketch points for downstream sketch consumption, projecting such points instead of sketch line in downstream sketch.

 

Attached a "fixed" model for your reference, I used projecting sketch points in sketch4 and sketch6. Comparing to projecting sketch line to point, I feel projecting sketch point to point is more stable.

 

Thanks,



Nicolas Xu
Sr. SQA Eng.
Fusion 360 Quality Assurance Team
Autodesk, Inc.
Message 12 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: NicolasXu

hi nicolas and thanks again, the information you gave me help resolve the problem i had with my "panel type" icopy tool

i'm tryin to create some more tool with icopy and facing other problem

if i post the files can you take a look at it and help me with that too?

 

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 13 of 20
NicolasXu
in reply to: Mike686

Hi Mike,

 

Please feel free to post any questions. I would be happy to assist you on the related questions. 🙂

 

Thanks,



Nicolas Xu
Sr. SQA Eng.
Fusion 360 Quality Assurance Team
Autodesk, Inc.
Message 14 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: NicolasXu

hi Nicolas

i've done a couple more icopy tool base on the tips you gave me, everything was working fine

but then i have this panel (panel 2, see attachement) that seem to have my old problem of position

 

i dont understand, i did like you told me, make my layout part adaptative then in the template assembly constraint my part to the assembly using default plane..like i did in other

but when i insert the panel 2 on the side of the target assembly, it flip my xy plane again...

 

can you take a look at it and tell me what i did wrong for this one..

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 15 of 20
NicolasXu
in reply to: Mike686

Hi Mike,

 

I did get a chance to dig into the dataset, but notice there is a Frame Generator member within it. When I place the second iCopy instance, there are some warning against the Frame member. Are you seeing the same error on you side? I'd suggest you remove the frame member first to test if the iCopy works as expected.

 

Furthermore, in the iCopy template, I found the sketch3 is landing on workplane1, and the workplane1 is referring to the frame member, and the frame member is referring to the sketch3. It looks like there is a circular reference. Is it the case?

 

Would you share more information for the design intent? (I think placing frame in iCopy might be too complex to update/adaptive.)

 

Thanks,

Nicolas

 

 



Nicolas Xu
Sr. SQA Eng.
Fusion 360 Quality Assurance Team
Autodesk, Inc.
Message 16 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: NicolasXu

Hi Nicolas

sorry about the lack of information

 

about the icopy template i've send you (panel 2) it's not the original its a simplify panel that i did base on my original panel that i was having trouble with.. i just did on insertion in the target assembly so i don't know if i would have get the warning

 

the reason i did'nt send you the original one is because it was made with custom structural shape inserted with frame generator and i didnt know if everything was gonna follow in the pack and go, so i went and did a simplyfy panel just so you see i was using frame gen in an i copy... i also didnt think i would matter because the problem i was having was with the positioning of the xy plane like i had before you help me..

 

for the circular reference maybe i did that when i switch the frame member base on a custom structural shape to a standard structural shape

 

here is a little more explication on what i want to do with this type of panel

 

if you check the skecth 1 you notice that i didnt put vertical or horizontal constraints, the reason is i want this panel to be able to adapt if the shape is not square. and i use frame member to be able to use the trim extend command to ajust the end of some part according to the shape of the panel..i've figured it was the best way to do it..

 

so like i said here is the new files

i've made another target assembly with a shape so you can see the result i want..

i also already insert 3 icopy assembly of the panel 3 and whats strange is the first panel i insert on the side layout  (the one with the shape) seem to work great but when i did the second one (square one) it show the problem i was talking about...weird...

 

so again thanks for helping me with this and if you need further information just ask

by the way i speak french most of the time so i hope everything is clear and there not too many mispell words...

 

 

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 17 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: NicolasXu

oh and you had me worry with what you said about

" (I think placing frame in iCopy might be too complex to update/adaptive.)"

 

so i went and did some change to the layout in the target assembly and everything seem to adapt when i change the dimension or the shape of the angle

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 18 of 20
NicolasXu
in reply to: Mike686

Hi Mike,

 

When doing iCopy with frame members, the frame members are reused by default (see attached CopyFrame.PNG, frame member is kind of Standard Content). It means the frame member under different iCopy instances will refer to the identical file in disk, i.e. sharing same length. So we need uncheck the “Reuse Standard Content and Factory Parts” option and copy the frame members, such that each frame member can adaptive to the desired length.

 

It might be the root cause of your problem. As I tried, after using Copy instead of Reuse, the iCopy result looks good (see attached iCopyResult picture). Can you give a try to see if it’s the case?

 

BTW, I see there are some errors in CUSTOM frame, better to fix them though not related to this issue. Just opening the iCopy template and clicking the design doctor (red cross in title bar), you will see them.

 

Please let me know if any follow-up questions.



Nicolas Xu
Sr. SQA Eng.
Fusion 360 Quality Assurance Team
Autodesk, Inc.
Message 19 of 20
Mike686
in reply to: NicolasXu

hi nicolas, sorry i havent awnser yet..

i'm in a rush at work so i didnt had time to check the file you repost

i'll do it during the holiday break

thanks again

 

Product Design Suite 2017
Message 20 of 20
sayerdesign
in reply to: NicolasXu

Hello, all.

 

I'm having this same exact problem with several iCopy Sub Assemblies I've reently created.  They work fine on the plane that they were originally referenced against, but they fail insert properly if used on any other plane.

 

"iCopy Template is the key assembly, which contains at least an adaptive layout part. You need align origin between the layout part (remove the grounded status if exists) and the top assembly."

 

Can anyone tell me how to interpret this quote from previously in the string?  It reads like if the layout part when imported into the master .iam file should not be grounded, but there are multiple instances where people have instructed to use the ground and root tool when that part is placed into the master iCopy .iam file.  Am I missing something?

 

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