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Sheet Metal (again!)

49 REPLIES 49
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Message 1 of 50
Talayoe
659 Views, 49 Replies

Sheet Metal (again!)

Something so simple...  I am sure I am complicating the hell out of it...and making a mess to boot. 

 

Have a part, rectangular 3.5 heigh x 46" long. I want to roll 270° it so that the center has a 10.875 rad.

 

I got one variation of it to go while tinkering but it took me about 8 steps. I hope this makes someone laugh cause its really annoying. Gotta take a sheet metal class or something meh thinks.

 

Any help/ideas or a quick ipt of somthing of the similar would be a wonderous help.

 

tks much! =]

-Randy

----------------------
Inventor 2017 PDS
49 REPLIES 49
Message 21 of 50
jletcher
in reply to: Mario428

Joking about what?

Message 22 of 50
jletcher
in reply to: JDMather

True I give you that...

 

 But all that replied to the way we would do it he seem not to be happy so I gave him what he asked..

 

If he would have ask how can I roll a sheet metal part 300° I would not had to post because you gave him that Smiley Wink

Message 23 of 50
Talayoe
in reply to: JDMather

Who you calling an OP!?? lol!! 

 

In truth it is a fantastic place to collaborate. Especially for people like me who sometimes chose to go by memory and get quickly corrected (thanks JD) when they are wrong 😉 And in a positive way.

 

Many ways to make a part and seeing different ways (not just in this case) is helpful, not only to me I am sure. 

 

Tks for making this a great place guys!

 

-Randy

-Randy

----------------------
Inventor 2017 PDS
Message 24 of 50
Mario428
in reply to: jletcher


@Anonymous wrote:

Joking about what?


About this "after making the sheet metal face convert to regular part, use the bend option then convert back to sheet metal.."

It is a simple part

Message 25 of 50
jletcher
in reply to: Mario428

No joke he ask how I gave him the how.

 

 Not that hard to convert and convert back 2 clicks..

 

 I have a client that does it this way even after showing him other ways he likes to do it like this...

 

The joke is why bend tool does not work in sheet metal and in standard..............

 

Message 26 of 50
Talayoe
in reply to: jletcher

So.... I am being made fun of for asking a question about why I have an icon greyed out? I dont find that funny.

 

I didnt know, I asked. I got an answer. I appreciated it.

 

Should have been the end. Guess not. Maybe I should try to ask -what to some may be- less obvious questions that I dont know?

 

 

-Randy

----------------------
Inventor 2017 PDS
Message 27 of 50
Mario428
in reply to: Talayoe


@Talayoe wrote:

So.... I am being made fun of for asking a question about why I have an icon greyed out? I dont find that funny.

 

I didnt know, I asked. I got an answer. I appreciated it.

 

Should have been the end. Guess not. Maybe I should try to ask -what to some may be- less obvious questions that I dont know?

 

 


Who do you think is making fun of you?

Message 28 of 50
JDMather
in reply to: Talayoe


@Talayoe wrote:

Who you calling an OP!?? lol!! 

 

-Randy


OP = Original Poster.  Sorry Randy, I don't tend to take notice of the names here, just easier and faster for me to use the shorthand OP.

 

 


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Message 29 of 50
JDMather
in reply to: jletcher


@Anonymous wrote:

 

If he would have ask how can I roll a sheet metal part 300°....


The problem I saw, by not modeling in finished form, it wasn't apparent that the angle isn't even close to 300°.

I keep thinking I got something wrong here. (see image in Reponse #11)  Did I do it right or did I miss something?

 

This image is created from the file posted in Response #10 marked as the solution?

 

jletcher.PNG

 

 


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Autodesk Inventor 2019 Certified Professional
Autodesk AutoCAD 2013 Certified Professional
Certified SolidWorks Professional


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Message 30 of 50
Talayoe
in reply to: JDMather

JD,

 

I was just kidding about that comment. My backround previously was CNC programming (5 - 7 axis machines typically). It was one of the trade things to be called an operator (even tho I am trade machinist). I will verbally abuse anyone who calls me that! (jokingly of course) 🙂 No need to be sorry. 

 

And for the 'joke' part; Maybe I just took it the wrong way. "The joke is why bend tool does not work in sheet metal and in standard......" It happens occasionally. Just like texting or similar, sometimes things that are meant one way are taken another. If it wasnt, then I retract previous statement showing I was slightly offended. Dont need drama, certainly not by me. I manage enough of that at work (if that can be!). I will just sum it down this once again; I appreciate all the help this board provides. It is a great help in all aspects. 🙂

 

Thank you all =]

-Randy

----------------------
Inventor 2017 PDS
Message 31 of 50
Talayoe
in reply to: JDMather

JD, 

 

You did get it right. I was the one who made the mistake. I should have just deleted the thread and started over with all my ducks in a row. I was going off memory and sadly it failed me a couple times in this thread. The difference between yours and the one I marked was that I found yours a bit confusing with the 3D sketch in it. For what I was doing, the bend part was plenty enough to accomplish this. Once we weld it to the cover housing it wont be round any more anyways so the bend differential to me (in this case) is a moot point (although good to keep in mind for more accurate future projects).

-Randy

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Inventor 2017 PDS
Message 32 of 50
JDMather
in reply to: Talayoe


Talayoe wrote: 

.... My background previously was CNC programming (5 - 7 axis machines typically). 


Similar background here.  I worked 8 years out on the shop floor as a (Journeyman's card carrying) machinist.


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Autodesk AutoCAD 2013 Certified Professional
Certified SolidWorks Professional


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Message 33 of 50
jletcher
in reply to: JDMather

Talayoe wrote:

 

Have a part, rectangular 3.5 heigh x 46" long. I want to roll 270° it so that the center has a 10.875 rad.

 

Then changed it to 300°.

 

I did not question his flat dimension he asked how to take a part 3.5 tall by 46 long roll  300° that is what he received now if you want it dimensionally correct the flat should by about 56.986 if using 1/8 thick material.

 

sheet metal.JPG

 

Again I gave what he ask with the dimensions given. If you look at the bend settings he received it at 300°..

 

 And the joke is not on Talayoe it is on Autodesk for making a bend tool that only works in standard parts that is the joke if you ask me..

 

 

Message 34 of 50
Mario428
in reply to: jletcher


@Anonymous wrote:

@Talayoe wrote:

 

Have a part, rectangular 3.5 heigh x 46" long. I want to roll 270° it so that the center has a 10.875 rad.

 

Then changed it to 300°.

 

I did not question his flat dimension he asked how to take a part 3.5 tall by 46 long roll  300° that is what he received now if you want it dimensionally correct the flat should by about 56.986 if using 1/8 thick material.

 

sheet metal.JPG

 

Again I gave what he ask with the dimensions given. If you look at the bend settings he received it at 300°..

 

 And the joke is not on Talayoe it is on Autodesk for making a bend tool that only works in standard parts that is the joke if you ask me..

 

 


Thought these threads were about learning about Inventor. I did not care about the specifics of the part. My thought was to show the OP how I would do the part, OP can then pick his favorite method and apply it to other parts he wants to model.

 

My objection is to using methods to create sheet metal models using non sheet metal tools, this forum is rife with people having problems with sheet metal parts. But many operate under the same flawed assumption, "I can model anyway I want, then click convert to sheet metal and all will be right!!!!!!"

 

NOT!!!!!!


If the part cannot be modeled with existing sheet metal tools then the flat pattern will either not work or have serious flaws.

Message 35 of 50
jletcher
in reply to: Mario428

Is not converting a function in Inventor?

 

Does me showing him this option not learning the software?

 

People posted the other methods so no need to do the same so I showed him another way and he liked it..

 

 It is not wrong to do what I did it is another method and will only be flawed if he does not check his work.

 

Most don't have tight tolerance plus or minus 1/4 is good with some.

 

I did use sheet metal but needed the bend tool that should also be a sheet metal tool.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Message 36 of 50
Mario428
in reply to: jletcher

Inventor has a "Fold" tool but seems to only go to 180 deg so should be drawn as a contour flange.

 

Do your models as you please but do you think your method is a good sheet metal tool since bend compensation is lost for those who do want an accurate part.

Message 37 of 50
jletcher
in reply to: Mario428

Mario428 Wrote:

  bend compensation is lost for those who do want an accurate part.

 

 

No not true at all you just have to make a sheet metal rule fo it....

 

 And the part will be accurate....

 

And you don't have to use a contour flange to make it you can use revolve also....

 

There are many ways.....

 

 

 

 

Message 38 of 50

Hi everyone,

 

In reading through this discussion it seems to me that the misunderstandings are coming from a loose use of terminology.

 

Bend Part tool: This is a standard part feature tool that is used to form parts non sheet metal parts. There is no material shrink or stretch compensation taken for this feature, and this follows industry practice for non sheet metal parts. For instance if we were running an L shape steel member through a bender machine, the starting length would typically be longer than the required finished length and then it would be cut to size by lopping off the ends. once the part is formed.

http://help.autodesk.com/view/INVNTOR/2014/ENU/?guid=GUID-04921375-BCF6-4931-B558-1C5756A518E7

 

Bend Compensation: A setting in the sheet metal tools that allows you to determine the total developed length using an equation:

http://help.autodesk.com/view/INVNTOR/2014/ENU/?guid=GUID-7814AF4D-2C01-4357-B2EA-5FB2D27E0A76

 

For the record, I would not recommend mixing the Bend Part tool with sheet metal parts as a matter of standard practice, as it is likely to give incorrect results that are not apparent until later in the design stage, and there is always a better way using sheet metal tools.

 

Often when a new user who is not familiar with the sheet metal tools is using standard modeling tools in an attempt to get some result (that may or may not be clear), it is best to read between the lines and direct them away from the standard tools and toward the sheet metal tools. Otherwise the user is likely to get to the manufacturing stage of the design and only then realize that they used the incorrect tool. But that experience is not necessarily a bad thing, since it often takes making a mistake to fully understand why not to do something, or do why not to do something in a particular way.

 

With that in mind, there is some merit in answering a user's question directly, and allowing them to discover the right and wrong methods for their needs, at their own pace, in a natural progression of accumulated knowledge. But we should do so with a warning, if we see pitfalls ahead of them.

 

I hope this helps.
Best of luck to you in all of your Inventor pursuits,
Curtis
http://inventortrenches.blogspot.com

 

 

 

 

 
Message 39 of 50
Mario428
in reply to: jletcher


@Anonymous wrote:

Mario428 Wrote:

  bend compensation is lost for those who do want an accurate part.

 

 

No not true at all you just have to make a sheet metal rule fo it....

 

 And the part will be accurate....

 

And you don't have to use a contour flange to make it you can use revolve also....

 

There are many ways.....

 

 

 

 


Revolve is not a sheet metal tool, again requires conversion to sheet metal. Which will get the less talented in trouble if they follow your advice.

 

All the advice put out here about modeling sheet metal parts using solids tools will guarantee an endless string of "can't create a flat pattern from this part" threads

Message 40 of 50


@Mario428 wrote:

Revolve is not a sheet metal tool, again requires conversion to sheet metal. Which will get the less talented in trouble ....

less talented ?

 

Surely you meant less experienced. Smiley Wink

 

 

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