Old version issues....

[cbenner]

I have a user who claims that he saved his assembly model before going to lunch and closed it.  When he returned from lunch and opened it back up, it had reverted to a version from approximately last Wednesday or earlier.  The model itself had not been checked into the Vault since 2/4 according the Vault history, but the drawing file had been checked in last week.  We attempted to open an "Old Version" which looked right in the preview, but opened up in the same condition as the one which looked like it was from last week....

Now, I have no idea what he did over there on the other siude of the wall, but does any of this sound familiar to anyone?

[pcrawley]

2013 or 2014?

If it's 2013, it sounds like they may have done an "Open" whilst in the Vault Client - thereby getting the assembly as it was last time it was checked in, as opposed to the latest version with all the latest versions of its children.

If it's 2014, no idea sorry 🙂

[stefaanboel]

Try also to get the old versions from the assembly first. Then open the drawing?

[jletcher]

This is one of the reasons I will not use Vault.

Had this happen at a clients see if you can find his local file on his drive there may be 2 places. I have no idea why but that is what happen to my client we found the good files and fixed it but trust me it was not easy to do took 4 hours to get it to work even after finding the files. Some were in one location and some were in another. Then had to delete the vault files because it would not let me put the found file in vault because drawing check in did not match file part date. Was a big mess..

 Good Luck you will need it..

[jletcher]

One more thing no one else was working in a higher assembly that had his assembly in as a sub did they?

 I

[cbenner]

Well, thanks guys... I still have no idea what the user did... they claim they were reopening the assembly after lunch break, and Vault prompted him to check somehting out... I don't think he even looked at what, just clicked ok.  He must have overwritten the local copy with an old Vault copy... only thing I can think of. 

Anyway, we were able to restore it by going to the file server, which creates a mirror copy of the files as they are saved.  It seems to keep two or three of those at a time.  We took that copy and placed it on a network drive outside of the active project, and while logged out of Vault, opened it in Inventor.  Of course we got a lot of unresolved file problems, but were able to solve most of them with local copies (most of them were library parts).  Once we determined that this copy was closer to his last save, I saved it on this remote network drive, deleted everything from his working folder, and copied this assembly from it's remote location back to his working folder.  Logged back into Vault and opened it as normal, this time with the correct project file loaded and Vault up, it opened with no problems and all library parts resolved.  His changes from the previous day were all there... 24 hours later we were off and running.

Not exactly how I wanted to spend the first day of OT, but... stuff happens. 

[Cadmanto]

Welcome to management Chris.  Been there!!! 

My guess is what you said.  They quick clicked and overwrote what was on the local without really paying attention.  Then the software gets blamed.

Has this user been trained on how to use Vault?  I know I used to keep the client open and would not relinquish ownership until I was either going on vacation or done with the project.  I had a lot less issues going between Inventor and Vault doing this way.

If this solved your issue please mark this posting "Accept as Solution".

Or if you like something that was said and it was helpful, Kudos are appreciated. Thanks!!!! 

     

[cbenner]

Gee, thanks Scott!

It looks like more training is definitely needed here.  Definitely more oversight on my part.  Have to get used to my new role!

[Cadmanto]

Not so much at my last job, but one I had for 14 years, I was the adminitrator to the PDM system.  There I would have to constantly monitor and fix users so called "Quick Click" mistakes.  Sometimes permission changes had to be made.

Something to think about in your role.  If there is one individual that you can trust to be an admin, let them monitor this.  I have been in this role in a couple of places, but I would make sure this person is well trained and equiped to fulfill the task.  You have enough on your plate without having to babysit users!!!

[jletcher]

Never blamed the software..

 But I do think it has to do with it. I don't like how it makes a set on the users computer and the server. This is where Vault I feel does wrong and why there are so many issues with it and users..

 I don't understand why it just don't leave them on the server in one place. .

  Here is one good reason.

  Had a client working on an assembly did 5 hours of work went to lunch came back moved mouse to wake up computer and the hard drive crashed all work lost, he did save it but not checked back into vault so only files that were changed were the ones on his computer. It was a nightmare to fix vault to understand files were lost and no longer checked out by user.

 Vault is just a managers nightmare. Even with training.. All the training in the world can't fix stupid or laziness...

[Cadmanto]

James,

Vault is not the only software that makes a copy on the local. Solidworks PDM systems do this same thing as well as I am sure others like Smart team.

I personally feel this is the way it should be.  All in the intent of preserving/protecting the original.  You never want to make the original (one in the vault) your working copy. 

If this solved your issue please mark this posting "Accept as Solution".

Or if you like something that was said and it was helpful, Kudos are appreciated. Thanks!!!! 

     

[jletcher]

But does vault not make a revision that is what it is for to keep a revision history. So you really never change the original. So why can it not do this in one location?

 But by placing in two places you are asking for issues and seen it fix them and seen companies waste hours and hours using it..

And I see no real reason anyone would want to spend hours fixing Vault issues when there are better methods that don't waste time fixing things..

There is enough wasted time with all the extra clicks the new interface added..

[jtylerbc]

---

@Cadmanto wrote:

James,

Vault is not the only software that makes a copy on the local. Solidworks PDM systems do this same thing as well as I am sure others like Smart

---

I've never really used Vautl, but every data management system I've used worked this way as well.  Even on the old Ideas system, for which the data manager wasn't a seperate program (was integrated into the CAD program itself), it behaved pretty much the same way.

I believe at one point, we had the last PLM software I used at my previous job (MatrixOne) configured to save to a user folder on the server.  However, that was still essentially just redefining what "local" meant to the software - there were still two file locations.  In principle it seems like it should be possible to do it all in one file location, but I've never seen a system that actually operated that way.

Perhaps it's a legacy of times when networks were slower, and it was faster to work on files locally?

[dgorsman]

Legacy concern, partially true at least.  If the process involves working on the content directly in the managed storage area, then that would involve some black-box software sitting between the user and the content, creating its own communication issues e.g. slowness, needing to understand the content structure (so it can't manage content from other software).  Even if it did the check-out to/from a common network location it still has to manage file rights to prevent access by the more... creative... users.

By far easier and simpler to only manage the metadata and check in/out process.  Less things to go wrong, less work to update for compatibility.