Modelling not free form enough

[Anonymous]

I have tried to loft the sketch below (all four corners have same end) to another larger version a specified height above. The idea was to build a rectangular hopper which is assembled with four triangular sheets being welded at the inside corner points.

Trying to loft this in IV. Forget get about it. As is expected now it gave me issues about forming and didn't let me proceed any further. That was both with auto loft and choosing transition points at all corners.

Can one even create something like this in IV?

Looks like I am back to autocad for this thing. Eventhough it doesn't make much forming sense at least I am allowed to draw it up.

[Anonymous]

Tom,

Could you email me the part to johnsonDOTshiueATautodeskDOTcom, so I can
take a look?
Thanks!

Johnson Shiue
Test Engineer
Autodesk, Inc.

wrote in message news:4986310@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have tried to loft the sketch below (all four corners have same end) to
another larger version a specified height above. The idea was to build a
rectangular hopper which is assembled with four triangular sheets being
welded at the inside corner points.

Trying to loft this in IV. Forget get about it. As is expected now it gave
me issues about forming and didn't let me proceed any further. That was both
with auto loft and choosing transition points at all corners.

Can one even create
something like this in IV?

Looks like I am back to autocad for this thing. Eventhough it doesn't make
much forming sense at least I am allowed to draw it up.

[Anonymous]

It sounds like your best approach would be a master sketch and then use the
sheet metal face tool to form the panels as fabricated.
wrote in message news:4986310@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have tried to loft the sketch below (all four corners have same end) to
another larger version a specified height above. The idea was to build a
rectangular hopper which is assembled with four triangular sheets being
welded at the inside corner points.

Trying to loft this in IV. Forget get about it. As is expected now it gave
me issues about forming and didn't let me proceed any further. That was both
with auto loft and choosing transition points at all corners.

Can one even create
something like this in IV?

Looks like I am back to autocad for this thing. Eventhough it doesn't make
much forming sense at least I am allowed to draw it up.

[Anonymous]

Tom,

I'm really getting the hang of master sketching / derived stuff for hoppers
and other things that have several related sheet metal panels. I can tell
you that I've never had such an easy way to go than to use the master sketch
method for making sheet metal things like hoppers, etc.

If you post a picture or hand sketch of what you're doing, I'll whip
something up on my lunch break.

It's been a rareity when I've had to actually use lofting to accomplish what
I think you're doing.


wrote in message news:4986310@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have tried to loft the sketch below (all four corners have same end) to
another larger version a specified height above. The idea was to build a
rectangular hopper which is assembled with four triangular sheets being
welded at the inside corner points.

Trying to loft this in IV. Forget get about it. As is expected now it gave
me issues about forming and didn't let me proceed any further. That was both
with auto loft and choosing transition points at all corners.

Can one even create
something like this in IV?

Looks like I am back to autocad for this thing. Eventhough it doesn't make
much forming sense at least I am allowed to draw it up.

[Anonymous]

I have to ask, and sorry for being so dumb. "Master Sketch"? what do you
mean exactly?



"John-IV8SP1" wrote in message
news:4986387@discussion.autodesk.com...
Tom,

I'm really getting the hang of master sketching / derived stuff for hoppers
and other things that have several related sheet metal panels. I can tell
you that I've never had such an easy way to go than to use the master sketch
method for making sheet metal things like hoppers, etc.

If you post a picture or hand sketch of what you're doing, I'll whip
something up on my lunch break.

It's been a rareity when I've had to actually use lofting to accomplish what
I think you're doing.


wrote in message news:4986310@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have tried to loft the sketch below (all four corners have same end) to
another larger version a specified height above. The idea was to build a
rectangular hopper which is assembled with four triangular sheets being
welded at the inside corner points.

Trying to loft this in IV. Forget get about it. As is expected now it gave
me issues about forming and didn't let me proceed any further. That was both
with auto loft and choosing transition points at all corners.

Can one even create
something like this in IV?

Looks like I am back to autocad for this thing. Eventhough it doesn't make
much forming sense at least I am allowed to draw it up.

[Anonymous]

Search this NG for "Skeleton Modeling" or "Master Sketch Modeling".

Basicly, you will create one part which consists of sketches, workplanes and
parameters. This will be your Skeleton Part.
In each "real" part, you will first derive this sketch and create your
extrusions/revolves/etc.

Put all parts/sub-assemblies together (by simply constraining them origin to
origin).

If you make a change in your Skeleton Part, all affected parts will also
update.

--
T. Ham
Mechanical Engineer
CDS Engineering BV

Dual Pentium XEON 2.2 Ghz
2 GB SDRAM
NVIDIA QUADRO4 700 XGL (Driver = 77.18)
18 GB SEAGATE SCSI Hard Disc
3Com Gigabit NIC

Windows 2000 Professional SP4
Autodesk Inventor Series 9 SP4
Autodesk Inventor Series 10 SP2
--

"David Bellis" wrote in message
news:4987202@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have to ask, and sorry for being so dumb. "Master Sketch"? what do you
mean exactly?



"John-IV8SP1" wrote in message
news:4986387@discussion.autodesk.com...
Tom,

I'm really getting the hang of master sketching / derived stuff for hoppers
and other things that have several related sheet metal panels. I can tell
you that I've never had such an easy way to go than to use the master sketch
method for making sheet metal things like hoppers, etc.

If you post a picture or hand sketch of what you're doing, I'll whip
something up on my lunch break.

It's been a rareity when I've had to actually use lofting to accomplish what
I think you're doing.


wrote in message news:4986310@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have tried to loft the sketch below (all four corners have same end) to
another larger version a specified height above. The idea was to build a
rectangular hopper which is assembled with four triangular sheets being
welded at the inside corner points.

Trying to loft this in IV. Forget get about it. As is expected now it gave
me issues about forming and didn't let me proceed any further. That was both
with auto loft and choosing transition points at all corners.

Can one even create
something like this in IV?

Looks like I am back to autocad for this thing. Eventhough it doesn't make
much forming sense at least I am allowed to draw it up.

[Anonymous]

David,

I learned the master sketch method from the masters, no pun intended. Kent
Keller and Sean Dotson have tutorials on their sites www.kwikmcad.com and
www.sdotson.com , respectively.

You know about derived parts, right. Well basically you use the same root
file for a set of parts and derive them from this root part. Make a change
to the root part, voila! The best part?? No constraints in the assembly
woohooo.


"David Bellis" wrote in message
news:4987202@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have to ask, and sorry for being so dumb. "Master Sketch"? what do you
mean exactly?



"John-IV8SP1" wrote in message
news:4986387@discussion.autodesk.com...
Tom,

I'm really getting the hang of master sketching / derived stuff for hoppers
and other things that have several related sheet metal panels. I can tell
you that I've never had such an easy way to go than to use the master sketch
method for making sheet metal things like hoppers, etc.

If you post a picture or hand sketch of what you're doing, I'll whip
something up on my lunch break.

It's been a rareity when I've had to actually use lofting to accomplish what
I think you're doing.


wrote in message news:4986310@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have tried to loft the sketch below (all four corners have same end) to
another larger version a specified height above. The idea was to build a
rectangular hopper which is assembled with four triangular sheets being
welded at the inside corner points.

Trying to loft this in IV. Forget get about it. As is expected now it gave
me issues about forming and didn't let me proceed any further. That was both
with auto loft and choosing transition points at all corners.

Can one even create
something like this in IV?

Looks like I am back to autocad for this thing. Eventhough it doesn't make
much forming sense at least I am allowed to draw it up.

[Anonymous]

In addition to checking out the master sketch method, I would also suggest you try lofting open loops into surfaces, and then use 'thicken' for your sheet thickness. You can do each side panel as a separate ipt, or each panel as a separate thicken feature in one ipt, depending on how you will detail the part(s).

See attached jpg for an example.

-Paul Cunningham

[Anonymous]

Here's another example, with the corner-to-corner seam. Each sketch has two lines, lofted, and then a 'thicken' for each panel.

[Anonymous]

Here's is what I meant. This is made up of 4 solids (sides) which where then sliced 4 times top to bottom (these levels are what the customer is asking for).

[Anonymous]

Looks like I need more IV training as these methods seem confusing to me, but it does look like they would give what I am after though.

[Anonymous]

How are the four levels physically attached to one another?
Do you have to detail/flat pattern each part or can you get by with detailing the weldment?

[Anonymous]

The 20 sides of the hopper will have to be cut, so I was looking to create a file to find the flat pattern dimensions. Right now I am just pulling horizontal/vertical dimensions off the acad file.

[Anonymous]

Well here's a start. I took snaps as I created the stuff. I don't have time
to make a "tutorial" per se, so if you have questions about the snaps as you
look at the Inventor parts and assembly, just post 'em here.

Also I have a habit of putting the master sketch into the assembly, for ease
of access. Usually I'll turn the visibility of it off tho. You don't have to
put the master sketch into the assembly - it just drives the parts.

As for the 4 levels I'm sure you can work out a viable solution for that.

I use KwikInsertNFix to bring the panels into the assembly after I've
created them.

So basically I loft the "internal volume" of the hopper and then "skin out"
the hopper, using this "internal volume" as my root file. Notice when I
derive the root part I use the root part as a surface, not a solid.

One last thing, I made the HopperHt variable, and so if you want something
beside 100, just open the master sketch, or root, part and click on the
little f of x symbol to edit the height of it. Hope this is enough to get
you on your way.



wrote in message news:4987589@discussion.autodesk.com...
Here's is what I meant. This is made up of 4 solids (sides) which where then
sliced 4 times top to bottom (these levels are what the customer is asking
for).

[Anonymous]

Oh - and the master part is constructed with a loft . . .



"John-IV8SP1" wrote in message
news:4987687@discussion.autodesk.com...
Well here's a start. I took snaps as I created the stuff. I don't have time
to make a "tutorial" per se, so if you have questions about the snaps as you
look at the Inventor parts and assembly, just post 'em here.

Also I have a habit of putting the master sketch into the assembly, for ease
of access. Usually I'll turn the visibility of it off tho. You don't have to
put the master sketch into the assembly - it just drives the parts.

As for the 4 levels I'm sure you can work out a viable
solution for that.

I use KwikInsertNFix to bring the panels into the assembly after I've
created them.

So basically I loft the "internal volume" of the hopper and then "skin out"
the hopper, using this "internal volume" as my root file. Notice when I
derive the root part I use the root part as a surface, not a solid.

One last thing, I made the HopperHt variable, and so if you want something
beside 100, just open the master sketch, or root, part and click on the
little f of x symbol to edit t
he height of it. Hope this is enough to get
you on your way.



wrote in message news:4987589@discussion.autodesk.com...
Here's is what I meant. This is made up of 4 solids (sides) which where then
sliced 4 times top to bottom (these levels are what the customer is asking
for).