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Helical component pattern?

15 REPLIES 15
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Message 1 of 16
mrattray
1970 Views, 15 Replies

Helical component pattern?

I have a sheetmetal assembly with helical shaped parts. I need to place about 50 little brackets and some corresponding rollers along the length of these helical pieces. The spacing is even so a pattern would be perfect, except I don't know how to get it to follow the shape of the part. The brackets are located to slots in the helical parts which were made with a rectangular pattern in the unfolded state. I tried to do a "feature pattern select" but it only saw the rectangular pattern as it is in the unfolded state (a straight line). I then gave up on patterns and started working on manually mating them into place but realized that the geometry of the slot was distorted (theory) and didn't leave me with any useable surfaces.

Does anyone one have any ideas on how to approach this? I'm at a bit of a loss.

I can post files if anyone wants to see them. (IV 2012)

nfg.jpg

Mike (not Matt) Rattray

15 REPLIES 15
Message 2 of 16
JDMather
in reply to: mrattray

Create a pattern of workpoints (and probably work axis) in the part file.

You can then use this with the Feature Pattern Select to place your components.

 

There is a similar example here.

http://home.pct.edu/~jmather/skillsusa%20university.pdf


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Message 3 of 16
mrattray
in reply to: JDMather

I tried your suggestion (and re-read your skills USA pdf) but I'm getting some funny results. The points are finding their way off of the part and twisting a bit.

 

 

nfg.jpg

nfg2.jpg

nfg3.jpg

Mike (not Matt) Rattray

Message 4 of 16
mrattray
in reply to: mrattray

The why makes more sense when I add the rollers. You can see how it's following the curve explicitly (not-unexpededly in hindsight) without regard for the other piece.

 

nfg.jpg

Mike (not Matt) Rattray

Message 5 of 16
JDMather
in reply to: mrattray


@mrattray wrote:

  The points are finding their way off of the part and twisting a bit.


You missed a step.
Attach your files (or simplified representative files) here.


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Message 6 of 16
mrattray
in reply to: JDMather

The pack&zip is too heavy to post (~3MB).  If you want to PM me an e-mail or ftp or something else of your liking I'd be happy to upload it.

Mike (not Matt) Rattray

Message 7 of 16
JDMather
in reply to: mrattray

Find the largest parts (in file size).
Drag the red End of Part maker to the top of the browser hidding all features.

Save the file with the EOP in a rolled up state.

Now when you zip (or even if you don't zip) it will be far far smaller.


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Autodesk Inventor 2019 Certified Professional
Autodesk AutoCAD 2013 Certified Professional
Certified SolidWorks Professional


The CADWhisperer YouTube Channel


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Message 8 of 16
mrattray
in reply to: JDMather

I never would have expected that. If I hadn't gone and tried it just now and seen that moving the EOP reduced file size to a tenth of original I would have called you a liar. That's truly baffling to me being how the same data, in my mind, would still be there. I'll have to add that to my catalogue of magic CAD tricks. Thanks!

Anyways, files attached.

Mike (not Matt) Rattray

Message 9 of 16
trumpy81
in reply to: mrattray

mrattray, I can't help with your drawing dilema but i took a look at the model you posted and thought I should point something out to you.

 

Your inner and outer flanges should follow the path of the rollers more closely than they do. Why? because as they are in the model at present they would present a negative chamber to the curve which would cause anything traversing the conveyor to either fly off or to crash and congest, which is something I'm sure you would want to avoid.

 

Repositon the top slider and inner flange to match the rollers rather than trying to get the rollers to match the flange.

 

It's all about the centrifugal forces experienced by any mass traversing the conveyor.

 

I hope that all makes sence and that I haven't sounded critical at all, just thought you should know is all.

Regards
Andy M
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Autodesk Inventor 2013 Pro SP1.1, Win7 Pro - 64Bit - SP1, Intel i7 960 @ 3.333 GHz
Asus X58 Sabertooth, Corsair 12Gig DDR3, AMD Radeon HD6970, Samsung 830 Series 256G SSD, 2x 3TB Seagate, 2x 2TB Hitachi,
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Message 10 of 16
mrattray
in reply to: trumpy81

I've read and reread your comment about 8 times now and I can't comprehend what you mean by "present a negative chamber to the curve" I assume you meant camber, but my very limited engineering background causes my brain to hurt when I try to figure it out. What I think you're trying to tell me is to have the whole chute follow a more natural curavture like the rollers are trying to do. Unfortunately, the strart and end points and orientations are set in stone at this point (approvals signed and all). The only place I have leway is in the between.

 

Back to the modelling cluster: I found some time to work on this thing this morning. I still can't find a way to get work features to follow that path. I tried adding the workpoints and adding them to the cut pattern in the unfolded state, but when I dragged the EOP back down to the folded state the work points failed to follow the bend.(see image) Just to add insult to injury, Inventor decided that I can't delete those points. I deleted them out of the tree but it only removed the original points. I even deleted and remade the pattern and they're still floating there. I tried dragging the EOP around to find a feature they may have magically become a dependant of, but they're still there even when I roll the part all the way to the top. Very frustrating.

 

I'll work on it some more through out the day, but if anyone has any ideas: please share!

 

Thanks

 

 

capture.jpg

Mike (not Matt) Rattray

Message 11 of 16
trumpy81
in reply to: mrattray

My apologies, that was a typo on my part, I did mean camber!

 

If everything is set in stone as you say, then you are going to have a problem with this no matter how you solve the Inventor dilema.

 

I wish I could help more but my knowledge of Inventor is somewhat lacking.

Regards
Andy M
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Autodesk Inventor 2013 Pro SP1.1, Win7 Pro - 64Bit - SP1, Intel i7 960 @ 3.333 GHz
Asus X58 Sabertooth, Corsair 12Gig DDR3, AMD Radeon HD6970, Samsung 830 Series 256G SSD, 2x 3TB Seagate, 2x 2TB Hitachi,
1x 1TB Samsung, 4 x 2TB Seagate in Netgear ReadyNAS NV+, Dual Asus VE278Q Monitors
Message 12 of 16
Namoi1
in reply to: mrattray

Mike

 

did you get this solved?  I got a similar problem

using IV2015
C-H
Message 13 of 16
JDMather
in reply to: Namoi1

Attach your assembly here.


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Autodesk AutoCAD 2013 Certified Professional
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Message 14 of 16
mrattray
in reply to: Namoi1

I can't seem to remember where that project lives on the server and my memory of it is foggy. I think I resorted to a brute force method of constraining each one individually to individually created work points.

Mike (not Matt) Rattray

Message 15 of 16
Namoi1
in reply to: JDMather

 
using IV2015
C-H
Message 16 of 16
Namoi1
in reply to: Namoi1

I zipped these files and for some reason it blew out to 18Mb, so when I've posted again I've forgotten the words, see below.

 

 

Here is the assembly, I've got it working (took a bit of working out the math, but got there, simple in the end)

 

But I've got a new problem.

 

When I'm detailing the flat pattern, I can't select any of the holes that finish up on a folded/rolled part, even though they were modeled before any folding.

using IV2015
C-H

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