YZ plane default orientation...What gives?

[timdown73]

I know this has been discussed in other threads but...Why is the YZ origin plane oriented this way by default?  Having the plane oriented this way results in horizontal sketch geometry being vertical in the "right" (view cube) view. That's very frustrating!  I thought this was going to change in 15 but it looks like they only made changes to the "look at" command which I do not use because it further complicates this issue.  Thoughts? Solutions?

[-niels-]

I think it depends on your template, this is my default orientation:

The only gripe i have is that when i hit "2D-sketch" it rotates to, well more or less what you're showing...

(maybe it's what you're actually reporting...?)

Anyway, i've gotten very used to hitting F6 for Home/Iso view and then selecting the plane i want to start the sketch on after that annoying rotate is finished...

[Ray_Feiler]

[Ray_Feiler]

You can change that in your templates. Use the attached 2012 file as a template to see if that is what you mean.

[timdown73]

Thanks guys but the "look at" option is not what I'm talking about.  If I make 2d sketch on the default YZ plane and put a horizontal constraint on a line the line will actually be vertical if I'm looking at it through the "Right" (view-cube) view.  Then I have to "edit cooridinate system" to get the "Y" axis to be vertical as it should be in the right hand view.

[Ray_Feiler]

Maybe changing this might help.

[timdown73]

Nope, thanks though. that just makes a sketch on the plane indicated when you start a new part.

[rdyson]

Yeah, I was a bit disturbed initially but have learned to accept and maybe even like the new behavior since JD pointed out the heavy axis line is horizontal and the thin one is vertical.

[Nicolas.Bourquin]

Hello Timdown73,

=> try to change in the application options :

>> display >> look at behavior >> select "Align with local Coordinate system" >> apply >> close >> close Inventor and restart.

=> open again the sketch => and now the directions of Y and Z axis should be correct

=> and the horizontal and vertical sketch constraints should be also correct.

More information about this option at this link.

I hope that will help you.

Best Regards

[timdown73]

Thanks for your reply Nicolas.Bourquin but as I stated above I'm not referring to the "look at" command.  I do not use the "look at" command.  What I'm trying to convey is that if I start a sketch on the YZ origin plane and align my view to the "right" view cube orientation; what should be up and IMHO "Y" (vertical) is actually "X" (horizontal).  I'v attempted to illustrate this in the two images below.  I'm pretty sure there is a logical reason as to why the dev team set things up this way, I would just like to know what that reason is.  It is very unintuitive!

        

[wimann · Accepted solution]

I'm familiar with your issue and all that I've concluded is this: when looking in plan (from the top) with the letters right side up, vertical is up and down and horizontal is left to right. Imagine, if you will, that as a grid and expand the lines of the grid such that they wrap around the cube but keep their horizontal/vertical orientation. The result is that the top, bottom, front and back views have vert/horiz that make sense, and the sides (left and right) are reversed. I've attached imagies to help illustrate my point.

Note in my images the orientation of the viewcube and how the orientation of the grid "wraps" around the sides. The sides should appear to have a horizontal where vertical "Should" be and vice versa. Thus it's reason for being oriented in 3D space as it is.

I hope this helps.

EDIT: I'd also like to point out the orientation of the word "horizontal" as it is "wrapped" around to the side face of the cube. I believe it matches your image where you wrote out "YZ Plane". Coincidence?

[graemev · Accepted solution]

Congratulations!  You have uncovered the Secret Holy War of computer graphical representation!

Many, many years ago, engineers and draughstmen (yes, it was spelled that way back then) agreed to a right-hand coordinate system for dimensional identification and display - typically X+ for East, Y+ for North, and Z+ for Elevation/Altitude.  Not quite so many years ago, computer graphics programmers agreed on a left-hand coordinate system for graphical representation and layering on display monitors - X+ for Right, Y+ for Up, and Z+ increasing for layers behind.  When CAD came along... kaboom.  (Though to be fair, when 3D computer graphics came along there was a significant disturbance in The Force.)

Inventor's approach appears to be to have the right/left axis use the alphabetically first axis label for the respective sketch planes with the third axis pointing out of the screen towards the user:

Front: X-right/left, Y-up/down, Z-towards

Right: Y-right/left, Z-up/down, X-towards

Top: X-right/left, Z-up/down, Y-towards

Does it make more sense than any other arrangement?  Depends on which university you attended.

I see from your screen shots that Up (Top) for you seems to be X+ from the orgin.  First time I've seen that arrangement!

We use (typically) X+ right, Y+ up for Front on all parts, likely due to CNC preferences for programming.  Assemblies may also use that orientation or Z+ as up, by either designer's preference or logical choice (architectural or civil structures, for example.)

[mrattray]

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@graemev wrote:

Right: Y-right/left, Z-up/down, X-towards

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I think you made a typo there.

[timdown73]

Thanks for all the answers guys!  I appreciate the time, thought and screen-shot setup that went into your answers.  Very helpful! 

And thanks for not confusing this issue with the "look-at" command. 

[graemev]

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@mrattray wrote:

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@graemev wrote:

Right: Y-right/left, Z-up/down, X-towards

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I think you made a typo there.

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Not once creating a sketch and suffering "Look at" orientation.  Otherwise, you would be correct.

[mrattray]

Ah, indeed; you're compounding the two "issues".

[timdown73]

I think some of my initial confusion comes from years ago using AutoCAD and flipping my UCS to the plane or surface I was working on. I'd start out at "world" UCS and flip it up on the X axis -90 for front then on the Y axis for right.  No view cubes back then.   

I'm among the first to tell people to forget what they know from AutoCAD when switching to Inventor. I guess I need to take my own advice on this one.

[Uziemblo_U]

Timdown,

you can orient your sketch (vertical and horizontal)

by changing "Edit Coordinate System"

right click on non active sketch.

then you define your "Horizontal"

uu

[graemev]

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@timdown73 wrote:

I'm among the first to tell people to forget what they know from AutoCAD when switching to Inventor. I guess I need to take my own advice on this one.

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... and you're still under the Autodesk umbrella.  Imagine how hard that is for those arriving from, or moving to, Vellum, Solidworks, Arris, SolidEdge, Catia, Creo, etc.

Learning a new language really starts to accellerate when you stop translating in your head back to your native tongue.  Likewise for software.

[timdown73]

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@Uziemblo_U wrote:

Timdown,

you can orient your sketch (vertical and horizontal)

by changing "Edit Coordinate System"

right click on non active sketch.

then you define your "Horizontal"

uu

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Yeah, I do that sometimes when I really need to. Thanks.  Would be nice if you could hard set it by default.  Guess I'd have to have a template made with a predefined right hand sketch.