Inventor General Discussion

Reply
*Walker, Russ
Message 11 of 20 (67 Views)

Re: Upgrades / Release Procedure

11-08-2002 09:58 PM in reply to: dpiengineering
Autodesk needs to differentiate between an SP1
level (ready for everybody, shipped CD) and an SP0 level (ready for the
adventurers, download).  Delaying the product by more betas or gammas or
whatever will never catch all the bugs and will only frustrate those willing to
put up with rough edges.

 

If everyone knows the refinement level going in,
fewer customers would be unhappy.

size=2> 

 

I think most people would agree that the SP0
release hacks a lot of customers off.  Further, history has shown that
SP0's of major releases will have bugs.  So why not shed the "SW / not
invented here"  paranoia and make a change to the test / release
/ patch cycle? 

 

Russ Walker

 



style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">I
am a former/current SW user. I think Autodesk and its client base should look
at what their major competitor is doing. SW issues what they call a
"pre-release". Users may download the pre-release as well as all new releases
and service packs from their web site (if they have subscription service).
Maybe autodesk should do something similar to this. SW implemented this
procedure in response to releasing SW2001 which was full of bugs; similar to
IV6. Also, they post what bugs they have fixed in the service packs so users
dowload and install only the service packs they may need if they are having
problems with the software. If you're not having problems you don't install
the service packs unless they come with some new features.

Another comment is, that after the release of SW 2001, all the other
releases afterwards have been relatively bug-free. I would suspect that SP1
for IV6 is going to be similar to SP1 for SW2001 or at least I would
hope.

Contributor
dpiengineering
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎03-05-2003
Message 12 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-09-2002 04:03 AM in reply to: dpiengineering
Flash,
Does it matter if I'm a brand new user to Inventor? Coming from the other side of the fence, I see somethings that SolidWorks is doing better than Autodesk in the way of releasing new versions of software. I think Russ Walker explained this point the best, please read his reply in this thread.
Active Contributor
flash
Posts: 45
Registered: ‎09-11-2003
Message 13 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-09-2002 09:28 AM in reply to: dpiengineering
Explained what? That I will recieve a CD release of my next SW already in sp1 format! Thats like shipping one of our assembly lines with revisions to a customer. I don't want them to know how many changes we had to make before shipment. Would you eat a box of cereal that said in bold letters across the front "Revision 3"? Granted I should get a reliable product out of the box no matter what I buy, but we both know that doesn't always happen. Who has time to kill to experiment with an sp0 level ("for the adventurous") when my job is to get work done. How many patches are too many? Inventor is developed on an aggressive schedule a major release a year and an minor release 6 months later. So far there have only been 2 (correct me if I'm wrong) sp's per release or 4/year. And because of the intensive testing per sp there have never been any regressive sp's. What is SW on now 5.1 or 5.2sp? You started this thread with the "Why doesn't Adesk release/test like the competitor does", but you didn't look into how it is setup on this side of the fence. A little research on your part and you probably wouldn't have posted here, but when it was listed how it is set up here all you could do was reference what someone else had to say about the other side. If the beta testing was nothing but a series of crashes and the pre-release followed suit with the same issues then a lot of people who thought they were downloading a "tested" pre-release product to work with wasted a lot of bandwidth to do the same thing. Those who downloaded the pre-release but were not part of the beta testing receive a list of beta bugs that had been fixed? I doubt it! I read the SW NG daily, that SW2003 seems to be purring like a well tuned car doesn't it? Missing a couple of cylinders! I am still a SW customer, and I maintain a few seats of it but we prefer to use Inventor (30+ seats) because of the across the board benefits we receive from it. Benefits we never saw in SW ................ I'm done posting to this thread, enough of the "Mine is better than yours". Flash. :smileyhappy:
*Crain, Ron
Message 14 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-09-2002 09:46 AM in reply to: dpiengineering
One thing that doesn't sit right with me, and I
would assume others, is that if you aren't a subscription user, you are out of
luck getting SP's.  Counter that with the fact that with Autodesk products,
you can always get SP's whether or not your subscription is current.  
I don't care for SW's policy in this matter and I don't like the higher cost of
their subscription service either. 

 

Hmmm, come to think of it, I don't like their
software either <g>. 

 

 


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
All
SW subscription users have access to the pre-releases. In essence it is an
excuse for SW in case there are bugs with the programs. They don't send out
the final released CD's until the "pre-release has been out for a couple of
months. They have beta testing as well prior to releasing the "pre-release".

     Also, the service packs from SW have had
bugs in them and have sometimes actually created problems that didn't exist
without the service packs. Don't know if this has been an issue for IV6. But,
yes they are historical so you do get all the service packs when you install
the latest one. Does Inventor post what bugs have been fixed in their service
packs?
Contributor
dpiengineering
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎03-05-2003
Message 15 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-09-2002 11:27 AM in reply to: dpiengineering
that was not a "mine is btter than yours" post, TAKE IT in what ever way pleases you the most. Geez, trying to throw an idea out there, there are better ways to do things, I think you have misinterpreted this entire thread. The way SW does things eliminates all these problems with every single person installing an upgrade before it is thoroughly tested, and eliminates all this complaining in this NG. Not intended to be a SW is Better than IV, or why would I have switched?
Enjoy....
*Rodriguez, Rob
Message 16 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-09-2002 09:59 PM in reply to: dpiengineering
I would also like to add something about the number
0f SolidWorks service packs.  Not all service packs deal with fixing
bugs.  Some service packs are to add new features or functionality. 
Maybe something was being worked on but wasn't completed in time for the
release.  Rather than wait until the next release SolidWorks will often
offer it earlier as a service pack.


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

Autodesk needs to differentiate between an SP1
level (ready for everybody, shipped CD) and an SP0 level (ready for the
adventurers, download).  Delaying the product by more betas or gammas or
whatever will never catch all the bugs and will only frustrate those willing
to put up with rough edges.

 

If everyone knows the refinement level going in,
fewer customers would be unhappy.

size=2> 

 

I think most people would agree that the SP0
release hacks a lot of customers off.  Further, history has shown that
SP0's of major releases will have bugs.  So why not shed the "SW / not
invented here"  paranoia and make a change to the test / release
/ patch cycle? 

 

Russ Walker

 



style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">I
am a former/current SW user. I think Autodesk and its client base should
look at what their major competitor is doing. SW issues what they call a
"pre-release". Users may download the pre-release as well as all new
releases and service packs from their web site (if they have subscription
service). Maybe autodesk should do something similar to this. SW implemented
this procedure in response to releasing SW2001 which was full of bugs;
similar to IV6. Also, they post what bugs they have fixed in the service
packs so users dowload and install only the service packs they may need if
they are having problems with the software. If you're not having problems
you don't install the service packs unless they come with some new features.

Another comment is, that after the release of SW 2001, all the other
releases afterwards have been relatively bug-free. I would suspect that SP1
for IV6 is going to be similar to SP1 for SW2001 or at least I would
hope.

*Laimer, Leo
Message 17 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-09-2002 10:15 PM in reply to: dpiengineering
I believe this topic is what we call a quarrel
around the emperor's beard.

It doesn't matter wheter we get a few or many SP's,
as long as the issues get solved as soon as possible. I know the update and SP
practise of both companies and would not put one over the other.

 

Regards,
--
Leo Laimer
Maschinen-
und Fertigungstechnik
A-4820 Bad Ischl - Austria


style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">

I would also like to add something about the
number 0f SolidWorks service packs.  Not all service packs deal with
fixing bugs.  Some service packs are to add new features or
functionality.  Maybe something was being worked on but wasn't completed
in time for the release.  Rather than wait until the next release
SolidWorks will often offer it earlier as a service pack.


style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">

Autodesk needs to differentiate between an SP1
level (ready for everybody, shipped CD) and an SP0 level (ready for the
adventurers, download).  Delaying the product by more betas or gammas
or whatever will never catch all the bugs and will only frustrate those
willing to put up with rough edges.

 

If everyone knows the refinement level going
in, fewer customers would be unhappy.

size=2> 

 

I think most people would agree that the SP0
release hacks a lot of customers off.  Further, history has shown that
SP0's of major releases will have bugs.  So why not shed the "SW / not
invented here"  paranoia and make a change to the test / release
/ patch cycle? 

 

Russ Walker

 



style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">I
am a former/current SW user. I think Autodesk and its client base should
look at what their major competitor is doing. SW issues what they call a
"pre-release". Users may download the pre-release as well as all new
releases and service packs from their web site (if they have subscription
service). Maybe autodesk should do something similar to this. SW
implemented this procedure in response to releasing SW2001 which was full
of bugs; similar to IV6. Also, they post what bugs they have fixed in the
service packs so users dowload and install only the service packs they may
need if they are having problems with the software. If you're not having
problems you don't install the service packs unless they come with some
new features.

Another comment is, that after the release of SW 2001, all the other
releases afterwards have been relatively bug-free. I would suspect that
SP1 for IV6 is going to be similar to SP1 for SW2001 or at least I would
hope.

*Caldwell, Larry
Message 18 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-09-2002 11:12 PM in reply to: dpiengineering
...of flogging a dead horse.
<G>

~Larry


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

I believe this topic is what we call a quarrel
around the emperor's beard.

It doesn't matter wheter we get a few or many
SP's, as long as the issues get solved as soon as possible. I know the update
and SP practise of both companies and would not put one over the
other.

 

Regards,
--
Leo
Laimer
Maschinen- und Fertigungstechnik
A-4820 Bad Ischl - Austria


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

I would also like to add something about the
number 0f SolidWorks service packs.  Not all service packs deal with
fixing bugs.  Some service packs are to add new features or
functionality.  Maybe something was being worked on but wasn't
completed in time for the release.  Rather than wait until the next
release SolidWorks will often offer it earlier as a service
pack.


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

Autodesk needs to differentiate between an
SP1 level (ready for everybody, shipped CD) and an SP0 level (ready for
the adventurers, download).  Delaying the product by more betas or
gammas or whatever will never catch all the bugs and will only frustrate
those willing to put up with rough edges.

 

If everyone knows the refinement level going
in, fewer customers would be unhappy.

size=2> 

 

I think most people would agree that the SP0
release hacks a lot of customers off.  Further, history has shown
that SP0's of major releases will have bugs.  So why not shed the "SW
/ not invented here"  paranoia and make a change to the test /
release / patch cycle? 

 

Russ Walker

 



style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">I
am a former/current SW user. I think Autodesk and its client base should
look at what their major competitor is doing. SW issues what they call a
"pre-release". Users may download the pre-release as well as all new
releases and service packs from their web site (if they have
subscription service). Maybe autodesk should do something similar to
this. SW implemented this procedure in response to releasing SW2001
which was full of bugs; similar to IV6. Also, they post what bugs they
have fixed in the service packs so users dowload and install only the
service packs they may need if they are having problems with the
software. If you're not having problems you don't install the service
packs unless they come with some new features.

Another comment is, that after the release of SW 2001, all the other
releases afterwards have been relatively bug-free. I would suspect that
SP1 for IV6 is going to be similar to SP1 for SW2001 or at least I would
hope.

Distinguished Contributor
jorgen
Posts: 578
Registered: ‎08-03-2003
Message 19 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-10-2002 08:30 PM in reply to: dpiengineering
I hope they never put new features into SP's for IV.
Imagine a sweet new feature in IV6sp3.
Of cource I use this new brilliant new feature in my models, and send my work to the customer.
He is on IV6sp2, and cannot open my files.
Total chaos erupts, and of course I get the blame.

Has this happened to SW users??

I'd say fix bugs with SP's, add features with new releases.

Jorgen
Contributor
tbryant
Posts: 14
Registered: ‎10-22-2003
Message 20 of 20 (67 Views)

Re:

11-10-2002 08:58 PM in reply to: dpiengineering
SolidWorks files can be opened with features regardless of what service pack you are on, only the major release needs to be the same.

Todd

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