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Active Member
s.shumeyko
Posts: 8
Registered: ‎09-07-2011
Message 1 of 14 (1,356 Views)
Accepted Solution

Frame Generator WorkFlow

1356 Views, 13 Replies
09-08-2011 04:34 AM

I've read and searched this form, but this is my first official post.

 

Recently the company bought a single license of Inventor to test out and see if it meets our company goals and is efficient to use for what we do.  I've been working with the frame generator, which is fairly easy to use and make the initial assembly, but I am having trouble and breaking out individual sections to detail. 

 

I am stuck with using LOD for this platform, but for future references I was wondering if anyone could provide a general workflow procedure of the best way of creating assemblies and subassemblies.

 

 

What I am currently using Inventor is to build a condenser platform. Generally we like to weld as much of it in the shop before it goes to the field for final assembly.  The platform consists of beam supports, grating, stairs, and handrail. In this case we would generally take sections of the handrail and weld in the shop, we would also have the stairs with the handrail welded on it as well. I would like to refrain from converting this to weldment.

 

I have tried promoting and demoting but this loses constraints and references. Also I cannot create a single skeleton of the whole frame at one time because a lot of the frame members depend on the other members structural sizes (flange width, height, etc.).

 

If anyone has suggestions and constructive criticism, I would love to hear it. I've read of people creating multiple subassemblies and grounding them, but I would like to think that their has to be away that I could just build off of the base skeleton and not have to cycle through different assemblies.

 

Thank you in advance.

Distinguished Mentor
pauldoubet
Posts: 703
Registered: ‎10-11-2006
Message 2 of 14 (1,304 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-08-2011 02:05 PM in reply to: s.shumeyko

I looked at the steps and platform. You can definitely do what you want with Inventor using Framer Generator and other features of Inventor. It is probably beyond what can be explained in the forum. You can share parameters from an Excel file or an ipt or iam file to help drive your model.

 

"Also I cannot create a single skeleton of the whole frame at one time because a lot of the frame members depend on the other members structural sizes (flange width, height, etc.)."

 

To briefly answer this concern you should look into using Work Planes in your skeleton to locate additional sketches for these elements.

 

The best advice I would give you is to get some good training and buy a good text book on Inventor.

 

Hope this helps, Paul

Active Member
s.shumeyko
Posts: 8
Registered: ‎09-07-2011
Message 3 of 14 (1,273 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-09-2011 04:23 AM in reply to: pauldoubet

Thanks for the advice, I am going to buy some refrence and help material.

 

In regards to the planes, I will attempt making the skeleton from a single sketch and adding unto that sketch as I place different members.

 

Another issue that I was wondering about is why doesn't inventor include smart notch features to the AISC standards for assembling strutural beams? I would imagine that the AISC standards are used widely in different industries.  I would really hate to create a notch profile for each different combination of structural members.

 

Lastly, anyone have a good way of populating clips into the drawing without placing individual clips one at a time? We use clips at basically all connections, welded or bolted, which is to AISC standards.

 

 

Valued Mentor
jeanchile
Posts: 722
Registered: ‎11-10-2009
Message 4 of 14 (1,252 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-09-2011 08:13 AM in reply to: s.shumeyko

s.shumeyko wrote:

Another issue that I was wondering about is why doesn't inventor include smart notch features to the AISC standards for assembling strutural beams? I would imagine that the AISC standards are used widely in different industries.  I would really hate to create a notch profile for each different combination of structural members.

 


You need to use a combination of the trim tool and iFeature to create these notches. It doesn't take that long to set up. The AISC provides an Excel database of all shapes and dimensions to members. You just set up the iFeature and copy and paste the information as needed from there.

 


s.shumeyko wrote:

Lastly, anyone have a good way of populating clips into the drawing without placing individual clips one at a time? We use clips at basically all connections, welded or bolted, which is to AISC standards.

 


This is where you need to create iParts, iAssembies, and iFeatures to do what you want.

 

Keep in mind this software tool is not Steel Detailing software. For that you need either AD's Steel Detailing software or Tekla or SDS2. All of which are crap. We have found that by investing the time and research, IV can be a useful steel detailing tool but it doesn't come that way "out of the box" nor was it designed to be.

 

The picure attached is an example of what we do all the time using FG, iFeatures, iAssemblies, and iParts. You can do the work no problem but not without spending time setting it up.

 



Inventor Professional 2013 (SP-2.3), Product Design Suite Ultimate
Desktop: Intel Core i7 3.4GHz, 16.0 GB RAM, Windows 7 Ultimate SP-1, 64-bit OS, (2) GeForce GTX 580 (331.81), Space Pilot Pro (3.16.1)
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Active Member
s.shumeyko
Posts: 8
Registered: ‎09-07-2011
Message 5 of 14 (1,230 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-09-2011 11:02 AM in reply to: jeanchile

Thank you, I wasn't aware that AISC provided a table, that would be quiet helpful.

 

The platform that you show is quiet similar to what we build, thanks for that.

 

If it isn't against your company policy would you be able to either send the assembly with necessary files, or maybe just somehow getting the browser uploaded in PDF form so I would be able to see what workflow was implemented. Once again only IF there would be no rights issues, thank you.

 

I am fairly new to the frame generator in inventor so I have much to learn if you have a good reference book that you use that show and teach Inventor capabilities, I would like to know what book it is.

Valued Mentor
jeanchile
Posts: 722
Registered: ‎11-10-2009
Message 6 of 14 (1,198 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-12-2011 10:46 PM in reply to: s.shumeyko
Let me see what I can do. I'm out of town for the next little while. I can recommend Mastering Inventor 20XX by Curtis Waguespack. It has several chapters that will help you out but you'll need to go through several in order to do everything you want, not just the frame generator chapter.

I'll try to post more information later... Don't let me forget!
Inventor Professional 2013 (SP-2.3), Product Design Suite Ultimate
Desktop: Intel Core i7 3.4GHz, 16.0 GB RAM, Windows 7 Ultimate SP-1, 64-bit OS, (2) GeForce GTX 580 (331.81), Space Pilot Pro (3.16.1)
Laptop: Intel Core i7 3.9GHz, 16.0 GB RAM, Windows 7 Pro SP-1, 64-bit OS, GeForce GTX 780 (331.81), SpaceNavigator (3.17.7)
Active Member
s.shumeyko
Posts: 8
Registered: ‎09-07-2011
Message 7 of 14 (1,149 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-14-2011 01:11 PM in reply to: jeanchile

Thank you, I've bought the recommend book, should be in tomorrow so hopefully that would give me a better understanding.

 

But, of course, a nicely done assembly would be nice to look at to even get a better understanding. If possible, I would like to look at the detailing and how it was layed out in .idw.  I am currently detailing different parts and subassemblies in the drawing I am working on and running into some issues trying to find the best work around of labeling individual parts accordingly to the overall assembly tagging.

 

To clarify I am not asking someone to spoon feed me the information, however, having a completed drawing to look at certainly would be helpful to learn from and possibly improve upon.

 

Thank you.

 

 

Valued Mentor
jeanchile
Posts: 722
Registered: ‎11-10-2009
Message 8 of 14 (1,123 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-15-2011 08:08 AM in reply to: s.shumeyko

I'm not going to be able to give you full content but I can help you get where you need to be, and I can share some things with you. Perhaps you can send me an email and we can take this information further. As Paul said (and he's an expert, he would know) there is too much info to share here. This combined with everyone's processes needing to differ it may be easier if you and I do this outside the forum.

 

Send me an email and I will try to help where I can: rmdetail_at_qwest_dot_com.

Inventor Professional 2013 (SP-2.3), Product Design Suite Ultimate
Desktop: Intel Core i7 3.4GHz, 16.0 GB RAM, Windows 7 Ultimate SP-1, 64-bit OS, (2) GeForce GTX 580 (331.81), Space Pilot Pro (3.16.1)
Laptop: Intel Core i7 3.9GHz, 16.0 GB RAM, Windows 7 Pro SP-1, 64-bit OS, GeForce GTX 780 (331.81), SpaceNavigator (3.17.7)
Active Member
s.shumeyko
Posts: 8
Registered: ‎09-07-2011
Message 9 of 14 (1,082 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-16-2011 03:30 PM in reply to: s.shumeyko

Thank you for the offer, email sent but was undeliverable for some reason. (to above)

 

I know I have been lacking on specifics of what I am trying to accomplish but I hope the following example would be helpful in providing information so someone would have suggestions.

 

The model I had created had a sloppy work flow, that combined with wrong usage of LOD's and suppressions caused the previous model to lose a lot of projected geometry references which made the handrailing and stairs I created previously unrepairable.

 

Looking at the provided picture how would you all suggest creating stairs (exact location not provided because it shouldn't matter on the workflow, if needed however I will specify)?  I would like to avoid referencing existing parts/members so there won't be a chance of it losing that reference.

 

Should the sketch be added onto the original frame skeleton sketch? If so what would be the best way of locating the workplane? I would like to have adaptivity so that if a frame member was to move, the corresponding parts would change along, but I am worried about it losing reference.

 

Same question as above goes for the handrailing that would be running around the outer edge of the platform and across the angle located across the ladder.

 

This is being done in Inventor Professional 2012, SP1.

16GB Ram, Quadro FX 580

 

(the bottom left corner is just a reference of an existing platform, it isn't part of the "actual" model)

 

(the included picture is of what I salvaged from the previous model, what is left is sound in workflow so the structure of it is solid)

 

Sorry it is so long.

Valued Mentor
jeanchile
Posts: 722
Registered: ‎11-10-2009
Message 10 of 14 (1,073 Views)

Re: Frame Generator WorkFlow

09-16-2011 04:55 PM in reply to: s.shumeyko

s.shumeyko wrote:

... email sent but was undeliverable for some reason.... 



That is because I am an idiot and gave you an incorrect address:smileysad:. The real one should be ".net" not ".com", sorry.

 

Before I start on a suggested workflow for this I would need to know your intent. Are you guys designing this with the intent to fabricate it or just design it? In other words, are you preparing fabrication drawings from these items or just design documentation and then a fabricator will prepare the shop drawings? Are you a steel detailer or an engineer?

 

Knowing the end result can help refine the workflow to accomplish what you need without any wasted time.

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