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Finite Element Type in Inventor

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Message 1 of 11
jwillieinventor
5994 Views, 10 Replies

Finite Element Type in Inventor

Hello All,

 

I wanted to know the element type Inventor uses for the FEM mesh. I know it is TRI but what type is it? Does it have just two nodes, three nodes, etc? In ANSYS Structural for example, the default 3D element type is PLANE183 for 2D plane stress and SOLID187 for 3D.

 

Your help will be appreciated.

 

Jimmy

10 REPLIES 10
Message 2 of 11
Ahatz
in reply to: jwillieinventor

It uses first and second order tetrahedron elements.

Message 3 of 11
Ahatz
in reply to: jwillieinventor

Here's a very good book on the subject

 

http://tinyurl.com/86yah8c

 


 

 

Message 4 of 11
jwillieinventor
in reply to: Ahatz

Hi and thanks for the help. I would assume that the first order tetra elements are the default? How do you then activate the second order elements?

 

Thanks!

 

Jimmy

Message 5 of 11
henderh
in reply to: jwillieinventor

Ahatz is correct, we use solid tetrahedral elements of at least 2nd order. For part document analysis, 2 p-refinements are done by default.  3rd order is used.  For assembly document analysis, 1 p-refinement is done by default, so it is 2nd order.

 

You can view the p-refinements (labeled as solution steps) in the convergence plot, assuming there are zero h-refinements specified.

 

 In R2013, we introduced shell elements which are the DKT type (6 DOF per node) and are quadratic and the order is 'fixed'. 

 

 This whitepaper explains convergence and refinements in more detail: http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=12953291&linkID=9242016

 

Hope this helps.  Please let us know if you have any additional questions, comments or suggestions. 



Hugh Henderson
QA Engineer (Fusion Simulation)
Message 6 of 11
jwillieinventor
in reply to: henderh

Hi Hugh,

 

Thanks for your response and insight. It was helpful. I wanted to know one other thing about doing Modal Analysis in Inventor. How are the mode shapes in Inventor Normalized?

 

Thanks!

Jimmy

Message 7 of 11
henderh
in reply to: jwillieinventor

Hi Jimmy,

 

  The modal analysis frequency calculations in Inventor Stress Analysis use the same system of equations that are widely used in FEM packages.

 

  The fundamental and harmonic frequency values are precise, but the displacement values displayed are for visualization comparisons only.  That is to say, the actual displacement values are arbitrary, and not 'real' since the actual displacements at those resonant frequencies will depend on the magnitude and frequency of the excitation loads.  Time-dependent loads and time-dependent prescribed displacements are not supported in Inventor Stress Analysis.  If a more in-depth modal analysis is required, we recommend using Autodesk Mechanical Simulation.  Product information can be found here: http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/pc/index?siteID=123112&id=13773836

 

  However, pre-stressed modal analysis is supported by checking the Simulation Propertes "Compute Preloaded Modes".

 

  I hope this answers your question.  As always, please let us know if you have additional questions, comments or suggestions.

 

Best regards, -Hugh

 

[Edit: fixed typo]



Hugh Henderson
QA Engineer (Fusion Simulation)
Message 8 of 11
jwillieinventor
in reply to: henderh

Hello Hugh,

 

I have done an FEM simulation and have this question. Is there a way you can know that your solution (Stress analysis or modal analysis) is mesh independent? I have varied the mesh resolution and each time i am getting a variation mostly in the first and second mode frequencies. The third, fourth, fifth and sixth seem to be changing less. So I am wondering whether the various values i am getting are physical (real or mesh independent) or non-physical (due to numerical errors or mesh dependent).

Any hint on how to get a mesh independent solution in FEM would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance!
Jimmy

Message 9 of 11
henderh
in reply to: jwillieinventor

Hi Jimmy,

 

  I will try to answer your question in two parts, since static stress and modal computations can be quite different.

 

  For a static stress analysis, there are a couple things you can check for results validity and mesh independence:

 

  1)  The reaction forces need to be equal (in magnitude) and opposite (in direction / sense) to the applied loads.  You can check this by accessing the Reaction Forces dialog via the right mouse click context menu on a constraint in the browser.  This is the first thing I check.  It can also indicate whether the model is constrained properly in the case of a zero reaction load appearing in a particular direction, when it is expected to restrain loads in that direction.

 

  2)  As you mentioned already, the mesh refinement can be a major influence on the stress results (most notably at and near a stress singularity / sharp 'inside' or re-entrant corner in the geometry).  However, the Displacement results should remain mesh density / refinement independent.

 

   That is to say, the convergence plot of the maximum stress can be diverging, yet the displacements converge.  This is indicative that you have a stress singularity in your model and the stress results are 'meaningless' at that particular location in the model / simulation.

 

  After a solve (whether or not a non-zero h-refinement is conducted) I usually launch the Convergence Plot to view the stress and displacement solution step results, to ensure I have a converging solution or if a model singularity exists that I need to either ignore or correct.

 

  In some cases, you may be able to 'cure' a singularity by adding a small fillet at the sharp inside corner...

 

  For a modal analysis the displacements are relative.  That is to say, the actual displacement result values are meaningless (e.g. x.xx mm) since those would depend on time-varying excitation loads in 'real-life' are which are not possible to include in a static stress analysis.  These 'displacement' results are to give a general indication of the relative displacement magnitude of that particular part of the model, for that particular mode shape.

 

  However, we allow you to converge results on a particular modal frequency.  In the Convergence Settings, if you set the stop criteria % small enough (after solving) you can use the Convergence Plot to convince yourself that further mesh refinements will not change the computed frequency (image attached to show an example).  This is the approach I would take for those two mode shapes you mention vary with changing the mesh density.

 

  I hope this helps answer your questions!  As always, please keep the questions and comments coming 🙂

 

Best regards, -Hugh

 

 [Edit: fixed a typo / moved a paragraph around for better reading] 



Hugh Henderson
QA Engineer (Fusion Simulation)
Message 10 of 11
john_entralgo
in reply to: henderh

The link to the white paper is broken.  Can you provide a new link?  Many thanks.


@henderh wrote:

Ahatz is correct, we use solid tetrahedral elements of at least 2nd order. For part document analysis, 2 p-refinements are done by default.  3rd order is used.  For assembly document analysis, 1 p-refinement is done by default, so it is 2nd order.

 

You can view the p-refinements (labeled as solution steps) in the convergence plot, assuming there are zero h-refinements specified.

 

 In R2013, we introduced shell elements which are the DKT type (6 DOF per node) and are quadratic and the order is 'fixed'. 

 

 This whitepaper explains convergence and refinements in more detail: http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=12953291&linkID=9242016

 

Hope this helps.  Please let us know if you have any additional questions, comments or suggestions. 



@henderh wrote:

Ahatz is correct, we use solid tetrahedral elements of at least 2nd order. For part document analysis, 2 p-refinements are done by default.  3rd order is used.  For assembly document analysis, 1 p-refinement is done by default, so it is 2nd order.

 

You can view the p-refinements (labeled as solution steps) in the convergence plot, assuming there are zero h-refinements specified.

 

 In R2013, we introduced shell elements which are the DKT type (6 DOF per node) and are quadratic and the order is 'fixed'. 

 

 This whitepaper explains convergence and refinements in more detail: http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=12953291&linkID=9242016

 

Hope this helps.  Please let us know if you have any additional questions, comments or suggestions. 


 

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