Hardware

[#1]

I have been drawing for many years & I'm starting to notice the effects of RSI forming in the knuckles & tips of my index & middle fingers.
Can anyone please suggest a suitable mouse & mouse pad that might relieve these fingers?.
The hand is starting to claw up & get stiff. My current mouse is a general microsoft mouse with a centre wheel that I use constantly for zooming. I know I can use my buttons for zooming but it's too slow by comparisson.
I've tried a movable raised mouse pad but the mouse kept banging into the raised wrist part which got annoying.
Many thanks.

[#2]

There is a company called evoluent that makes something called a
verticalmouse. Way overpriced but it relieves wrist pressures that can
cause symptoms in the fingers. But what is price compared to pain
relief. It does it by putting hand into an on-edge rather than flat
position. Best advice I can give is connect both this mouse and a
conventional mouse to your computer and alternate between the mice every
hour or so.

f.knight@hjr.com.au wrote:
> I have been drawing for many years & I'm starting to notice the effects
> of RSI forming in the knuckles & tips of my index & middle fingers. Can
> anyone please suggest a suitable mouse & mouse pad that might relieve
> these fingers?. The hand is starting to claw up & get stiff. My current
> mouse is a general microsoft mouse with a centre wheel that I use
> constantly for zooming. I know I can use my buttons for zooming but it's
> too slow by comparisson. I've tried a movable raised mouse pad but the
> mouse kept banging into the raised wrist part which got annoying. Many
> thanks.

[#3]

On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 13:25:57 +0000, Jerry G wrote:

>There is a company called evoluent that makes something called a
>verticalmouse. Way overpriced but it relieves wrist pressures that can
>cause symptoms in the fingers. But what is price compared to pain
>relief. It does it by putting hand into an on-edge rather than flat
>position. Best advice I can give is connect both this mouse and a
>conventional mouse to your computer and alternate between the mice every
>hour or so.

I think the cause of most RSI issues is having a keyboard and mouse on the
physical desk, which is much higher than the elbow, leading to a kinked posture
and narrowing of the nerve tunnel to the hand.

I've been using an articulated keyboard tray / mousepad for some years now, 8+
hours of hard use, and I have no symptoms of RSI. It is very easy to adjust the
tray, and I adjust it many times a day unconsciously as my posture changes. This
keeps me from working in the same position for too long which I believe is key
to avoiding RSI. I even installed a second one with a larger board so I could
put my laptop on it.

I use these from Humanscale:
http://www.humanscale.com/products/keyboard_systems.cfm

Matt
matt@stachoni.com

[#4]

I also use the human scale keyboard and mouse trays and love them. I put
them on every desk here. I also had problems with my index finger and
sometimes with my middle finger. I had to wear a finger brace for a while.
I found that a Microsoft five button optical mouse helped because I could
reprogram the buttons to use my thumb and ring or pinky fingers instead of
my index and middle fingers. Now that the problem is gone, I switch back
and forth during the day and don't have a problem with any of my fingers.

Brad
C3D 2009 SP1
XP Pro

"Matt Stachoni" wrote in message
news:6135727@discussion.autodesk.com...
On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 13:25:57 +0000, Jerry G wrote:

>There is a company called evoluent that makes something called a
>verticalmouse. Way overpriced but it relieves wrist pressures that can
>cause symptoms in the fingers. But what is price compared to pain
>relief. It does it by putting hand into an on-edge rather than flat
>position. Best advice I can give is connect both this mouse and a
>conventional mouse to your computer and alternate between the mice every
>hour or so.

I think the cause of most RSI issues is having a keyboard and mouse on the
physical desk, which is much higher than the elbow, leading to a kinked
posture
and narrowing of the nerve tunnel to the hand.

I've been using an articulated keyboard tray / mousepad for some years now,
8+
hours of hard use, and I have no symptoms of RSI. It is very easy to adjust
the
tray, and I adjust it many times a day unconsciously as my posture changes.
This
keeps me from working in the same position for too long which I believe is
key
to avoiding RSI. I even installed a second one with a larger board so I
could
put my laptop on it.

I use these from Humanscale:
http://www.humanscale.com/products/keyboard_systems.cfm

Matt
matt@stachoni.com

[#5]

Thankyou all for your responses (oh, what fun I've had with passwords etc trying to get back on here!).
I'll investigate all.
My chair has arm rests which are level with the desk.
Has anyone ever used the Perfit mouse before? It looks interesting.

http://store.ergocube.com/comoopleorri.html

[#6]

I too am at the point of full injury (RSI) for my drafting mouse hand. First off look to getting an ergonomic assessment done for your workstation. If you cannot get one done due to non-availability here's a few tips.

When dealing with mice use always have only your elbow supported. The soft tissue in your wrist can be damaged by resting your hand on a pad. When typing never rest your wrists on anything, same problem as the mouse.

Make certain your chair supports not only your back but the position of your bum and elbows. For the underside of your lap (that bum I mentioned) you should have no more than two to three fingers between the underside of you knee to the front of the seat while still having your backside completely supported. Your knees, hips and elbows should be at right angles!!

Evoulent I understand is a good product, I went further and purchased the E-Quill mouse. Basically the vertical mouse with a rest for the wrist, it's not against the soft tissue of the wrist, so it was good. Unfortunately these mice may not, in the case of the E-Quill a certainty, are not made for AutoCAD drafting. Meaning they will not last. I do a lot of shore line digitization so my mouse click use sounds like I'm using castinets (flaminco dancers).

Braces are great in that unless the problem is addressed, then they just push your injury/pain further up your arm. Every hour walk away from your computer. Do some filing or whatever, you need to rest your arms and eyes.

Stretch!!!! A good one for the wrist is: arm extended forward, palm up. now with the other hand pull the fingers down slowly (this is best done when you have warmed up muscles). for the shoulders: try and touch the inside of your elbow (crook of arm) to the opposite shoulder, you will need to use your other hand to pull it in; another - with your right hand touch your spine with an open palm at the top your back, with the left hand grab your right elbow and pull it towards your left side.

Always go in there knowing what you need, not what you want. A lot of companies and Government offices have access to nursing staff who can do assessments. From a manager's point of view the less injuries you have the less time you'll be off on compensation or sick leave.

Always, always, always do business with a company that allows you to test-hop their products. You don't want to fork out a few $100-$1000+ on something you'll eventually rest your feet on, unless of course it was a foot rest you purchased.

[#7]

I don't think my desk cost $400, even when it new back in WWII... (

HAve fun,
Dave

"Matt Stachoni" wrote:
On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 13:25:57 +0000, Jerry G wrote:

>There is a company called evoluent that makes something called a
>verticalmouse. Way overpriced but it relieves wrist pressures that can
>cause symptoms in the fingers. But what is price compared to pain
>relief. It does it by putting hand into an on-edge rather than flat
>position. Best advice I can give is connect both this mouse and a
>conventional mouse to your computer and alternate between the mice every
>hour or so.

I think the cause of most RSI issues is having a keyboard and mouse on the
physical desk, which is much higher than the elbow, leading to a kinked
posture
and narrowing of the nerve tunnel to the hand.

I've been using an articulated keyboard tray / mousepad for some years now,
8+
hours of hard use, and I have no symptoms of RSI. It is very easy to adjust
the
tray, and I adjust it many times a day unconsciously as my posture changes.
This
keeps me from working in the same position for too long which I believe is
key
to avoiding RSI. I even installed a second one with a larger board so I
could
put my laptop on it.

I use these from Humanscale:
http://www.humanscale.com/products/keyboard_systems.cfm

Matt
matt@stachoni.com

[#8]

Thankyou David for your helpful response! Must have taken you ages to write that for me. I really appreciate it.
Still none the wiser though on what mouse to go for. Looked at the Humanscale products. Not sure they're what I'm after. Was told that the mouse click was rather slow, so that's no good.
I've had this suggested to me:
http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/mice_pointers/trackballs/&cl=au,en
(It will take you to the Logitech website)
Haven't investigated this one yet.
Maybe someone out there uses it & could maybe put their two bobs worth in please?
Thanks again everyone!

[#9]

Trackballs are a very individual taste. People who like trackballs are
like Mac users in they think that they are superior because they made
the "smart" choice. The rest of the world think they're crazy. Neither
one is right. Personally I don't like trackballs. Don't believe that
they eliminate RSI. They simply change which nerves are affected.

Alias2 wrote:
> Thankyou David for your helpful response! Must have taken you ages to
> write that for me. I really appreciate it. Still none the wiser though
> on what mouse to go for. Looked at the Humanscale products. Not sure
> they're what I'm after. Was told that the mouse click was rather slow,
> so that's no good. I've had this suggested to me:
> http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/mice_pointers/trackballs/&cl=au,en (It
> will take you to the Logitech website) Haven't investigated this one
> yet. Maybe someone out there uses it & could maybe put their two bobs
> worth in please? Thanks again everyone!

[#10]

A very true statement: the problem is constant repetitive motion, not the
device you use. To truly avoid the problem you need to not do repetitive
motions with your hand/arm for a single whole day.

So get a mouse, a trackball, a tablet-with-pen, a touch-pad and learn to use
the other hand occasionally: re-adjusting your seating position and your
table may help too.

The real problem is no one will talk about: once you are diagnosed with RSI
there is no solution or repair, the damage is done and not going away. You
must now truly and effectively seek out out mousing solutions and change
them up several times a day. You also need to introduce exercise, breaks,
and other cures to take care of your hand several times a day.

--
Dean Saadallah
Trackball and Tablet User
--