xrefs and to many plot tabs

[Anonymous]

I deal with may sub consultants that seem to not use xrefs at all, all info
is in model space even details with 10 to 20 plot tabs for the different
sheets

I like to have a xref for base mapping, site work, another for landscaping,
and use plot tabs for just const. plans

then create a new file for landscape plans with just plot tabs for land
scape sheets

another for profiles, with the profile sheet tabs. so on

it seems like plot tabs are being abused and the lack of external references
in no longer being used.


what do you guys do??

[Anonymous]

We use xref's but no layout tabs. So far we have too many projects where
two people may have to be in different parts of the same plan. On my solo
projects however, I use the layout tabs.

My $.02

Matt

[Anonymous]

Multiple xrefs, multiple tabs.

[Anonymous]

(Civil Land Development)

minimum number of xrefs (but they are used), one layout tab for every sheet.

An average 30 sheet plan set might be spread across 4 drawing files, 5 tops.

"caddman" wrote in message
news:4853669@discussion.autodesk.com...
I deal with may sub consultants that seem to not use xrefs at all, all info
is in model space even details with 10 to 20 plot tabs for the different
sheets

I like to have a xref for base mapping, site work, another for landscaping,
and use plot tabs for just const. plans

then create a new file for landscape plans with just plot tabs for land
scape sheets

another for profiles, with the profile sheet tabs. so on

it seems like plot tabs are being abused and the lack of external references
in no longer being used.


what do you guys do??

[Anonymous]

We are in the consulting business and use xrefs and one layout tab per
drawing sheet. The only time we use more than one tab is when a
building is too large to fit on one drawing. Then we use multiple tabs,
match lines, key plans etc. It sounds like you might be looking for
consultants that are more in tune with your methods. Do you do any work
in the NW;)

caddman wrote:
> I deal with may sub consultants that seem to not use xrefs at all, all info
> is in model space even details with 10 to 20 plot tabs for the different
> sheets
>
> I like to have a xref for base mapping, site work, another for landscaping,
> and use plot tabs for just const. plans
>
> then create a new file for landscape plans with just plot tabs for land
> scape sheets
>
> another for profiles, with the profile sheet tabs. so on
>
> it seems like plot tabs are being abused and the lack of external references
> in no longer being used.
>
>
> what do you guys do??

[Anonymous]

We use a single layout tab per drawing, and multiple paste as blocks. Ahhhhhhhhh!
I'm making good progress on changing our work practises to include xrefs. (had to change document management systems to one that can handle them).
People who havent used xrefs before oftem seem to be scared of them. Its a bit like being scared of the dark I guess.

At least they are actually using layout tabs........

[Anonymous]

When the multiple layout tabs first became available, I thought they had a
lot of potential, and I started to use them extensively.

Now I see that more than a few can really slow down loading, and layout tabs
cost memory.

For me I see that xrefs are now the direction, particularly in ADT, and
depending on the sheets, a few layouts, or more usually, one layout, or
maybe one layout per sheet size for the same drawing plot.

However, I mostly do small projects now at home, and so only look back at
larger work of the past, and can rethink what I did then, and what I would
do now differently, and that would be to use more xrefs, and less layouts.

Jack Talsky

[Anonymous]

We use very many xrefs, and lots of layout tabs, basically we are mapping services (electricity / Gas etc ) for a whole town and surrounding area, different services and other background stuff comes in as xrefs (then when a service changes, we just swap out the xref)
splitting the town down to manageable bites, and individual drawings showing areas in detail are done in the layout tabs, all drawing work is done in modelspace, the only info in paperspace is the title blocks, keys and other 'drawing sheet' stuff. we use each viewport to select the information needed for that drawing. some drawings have 50 - 60 xrefs attatched, and 200+ layout tabs, the design file is about 6Mb, this is reduced down from about 130Mb when we tried to do it without Xrefs, this size was a problem as saves and autosaves were taking 20+ minutes a time.

[Anonymous]

this is all good news, so I am not alone, I get huge files that must be
done by one person, with no xrefs
and thousands of layers that you cant even filter, than to add more
trouble, the file is rotated off the coordinates
one would think that this no longer goes on, (sorry rant)

I limit the use of tabs and force xrefs for all parts of a working set of
dwgs.

thanks for all your info
wrote in message news:4854168@discussion.autodesk.com...
We use very many xrefs, and lots of layout tabs, basically we are mapping
services (electricity / Gas etc ) for a whole town and surrounding area,
different services and other background stuff comes in as xrefs (then when a
service changes, we just swap out the xref)
splitting the town down to manageable bites, and individual drawings showing
areas in detail are done in the layout tabs, all drawing work is done in
modelspace, the only info in paperspace is the title blocks, keys and other
'drawing sheet' stuff. we use each viewport to select the information needed
for that drawing. some drawings have 50 - 60 xrefs attatched, and 200+
layout tabs, the design file is about 6Mb, this is reduced down from about
130Mb when we tried to do it without Xrefs, this size was a problem as saves
and autosaves were taking 20+ minutes a time.

[Anonymous]

The worse one we get is the same project where they have introduced a scaling of 0.9997 to the maps to allow their GPS coordinates to be reflected correctly on the drawings, then they moved the 0,0 mapping co-ordinates 4000 miles out to sea, oh & then whatever units we use (mm or m), we have to either scale everything up or down by 1000, as the architects / other contractors cannot be consistent in their units.

[jorgeledezma]

I don't get how XREF may not be used in a project. Everybody has to use it! At least you want to double work.

Caddam the thing is about who are using tabs for the sheets or the project manager sheets for the same.

Project manager has a few issues at this time and I waiting when it will be more reliable. But this is a great tool.

Tab sheets could be nicer if everybody works in this way, but it is not. Some contractors we have doesn't use it and is painful to create dwgs specially for them. And by the other hand the international standards says that should be a file *.dwg for each sheet (like project managers works)

In our case, I do create a main model, most times architecture model because is the first clear thing. I call it xxx ARQ.dwg. Them I create electrical, and mechanical stuffs in others dwgs XXX ELE.DWG and xxx MEC.dwg, which are referencing the main architecture model. And so on.

At this time I am creating sheets "manually".

[Anonymous]

I am presently finishing a 12 sheet job. All 12 sheets are laid out in the
same file with titleblocks in modelspace and xreffed views also in
modelspace. This makes placing titlemarks and callouts simple. There
are 12 layouts each with only 1 viewport and the plot settings. The
sheet file is 209Kb. It loads in a few seconds. The entire sheet set
can be plotted by highlighting all the tabs and choosing publish.

When I use ADT, the automatic process of creating sheets and placing
views ensures 1 layout per sheet file. The project navigator manages
the callout resolution and titlemark generation. It also manages publishing.

Hope that helps.



"caddman" wrote in message news:4853669@discussion.autodesk.com...
I deal with may sub consultants that seem to not use xrefs at all, all info
is in model space even details with 10 to 20 plot tabs for the different
sheets

I like to have a xref for base mapping, site work, another for landscaping,
and use plot tabs for just const. plans

then create a new file for landscape plans with just plot tabs for land
scape sheets

another for profiles, with the profile sheet tabs. so on

it seems like plot tabs are being abused and the lack of external references
in no longer being used.


what do you guys do??

[Anonymous]

> am presently finishing a 12 sheet job. All 12 sheets are laid out in the same file with titleblocks in modelspace...

wait a minute... all the TBs are in MS?? overlapping one another?? on different layers?? How's this work??


> There are 12 layouts each with only 1 viewport and the plot settings.

so the advantage you have of TB's in MS is what? You have the layout tabs anyway, you have the same amount of TB's anyway, same number of pagesetups. What's the advantage of leaving the TB's in MS?

[Anonymous]

I used to use a similar system. You really only had one titleblock in MS,
with the plan title/sheetno the only things that needed their own layers.

heck, lay this out right and you don't even need PS.........as long as the
scale never changed thru the set, and there were no match lines, and you
could crop the geometry into the border, and you had a mile-long script to
plot the durn thing, and there were no plan&profiles, and..........


wrote in message news:4855031@discussion.autodesk.com...
> you have the same amount of TB's anyway

[Anonymous]

Glad you asked. See below:

wrote in message news:4855031@discussion.autodesk.com...
>> am presently finishing a 12 sheet job. All 12 sheets are laid out in the same file with
titleblocks in modelspace...

>wait a minute... all the TBs are in MS?? overlapping one another?? on different layers??
How's this work??
TB's next to one another (scaled up to the most common plot size).


>> There are 12 layouts each with only 1 viewport and the plot settings.

>so the advantage you have of TB's in MS is what? You have the layout tabs anyway, you
have the same amount >of TB's anyway, same number of pagesetups. What's the advantage of
leaving the TB's in MS?

Ease of keying and cross-referencing and organizing the set onto sheets. Its easier to
move a detail from one
sheet to another if both are in model space than to delete viewports and recreate them. I
have keys that communicate with titlemarks. The titlemarks label themselves based on
where they are on each sheet. When
I move a detail with its titlemark, the keys can be refreshed to point to the new detail
location. The same elevation or section key might need to be placed on a number of
sheets. Its just easier during this process to pan than to switch layouts.

This isn't suitable for all types of work but works very well for casework drawings and
for details. For buildings, using ADT, the project navigator approach is great (which
puts one titleblock in paperspace and automatically creates the scaled viewports with the
correct layer display)

Each type of work tends to have a different optimal layout organization. When I need to
display different states of the same base plan by turning on different groups of layers,
it pays to place the baseplan once in the model space and use different layouts with
viewports that control layer display.

Regards,
Doug

[Anonymous]

One word......"Wow"

Matt

"Doug Broad" wrote in message
news:4855125@discussion.autodesk.com...
Glad you asked. See below:

wrote in message news:4855031@discussion.autodesk.com...
>> am presently finishing a 12 sheet job. All 12 sheets are laid out in the
same file with
titleblocks in modelspace...

>wait a minute... all the TBs are in MS?? overlapping one another?? on
different layers??
How's this work??
TB's next to one another (scaled up to the most common plot size).


>> There are 12 layouts each with only 1 viewport and the plot settings.

>so the advantage you have of TB's in MS is what? You have the layout tabs
anyway, you
have the same amount >of TB's anyway, same number of pagesetups. What's the
advantage of
leaving the TB's in MS?

Ease of keying and cross-referencing and organizing the set onto sheets.
Its easier to
move a detail from one
sheet to another if both are in model space than to delete viewports and
recreate them. I
have keys that communicate with titlemarks. The titlemarks label themselves
based on
where they are on each sheet. When
I move a detail with its titlemark, the keys can be refreshed to point to
the new detail
location. The same elevation or section key might need to be placed on a
number of
sheets. Its just easier during this process to pan than to switch layouts.

This isn't suitable for all types of work but works very well for casework
drawings and
for details. For buildings, using ADT, the project navigator approach is
great (which
puts one titleblock in paperspace and automatically creates the scaled
viewports with the
correct layer display)

Each type of work tends to have a different optimal layout organization.
When I need to
display different states of the same base plan by turning on different
groups of layers,
it pays to place the baseplan once in the model space and use different
layouts with
viewports that control layer display.

Regards,
Doug

[Anonymous]

I also use the same sheet file for numerous projects. The titlemarks
reference another file that actually contains the titleblock. All the plot
settings are stable from project to project. Only items in titleblock that
change from job to job are: job number, project info, release date,
state seal.

Its relatively easy from the sheet file to ensure that all project files have
been referenced into the sheet file.

Regards,
Doug


"Doug Broad" wrote in message
news:4855125@discussion.autodesk.com...
Glad you asked. See below:

[Anonymous]

That should be titleblocks, not titlemarks.

"Doug Broad" wrote in message
news:4855147@discussion.autodesk.com...
I also use the same sheet file for numerous projects. The titlemarks

[Anonymous]

and it should be "too many plot tabs", not "to many plot tabs"...

"Doug Broad" wrote in message
news:4855156@discussion.autodesk.com...
That should be titleblocks, not titlemarks.

"Doug Broad" wrote in message
news:4855147@discussion.autodesk.com...
I also use the same sheet file for numerous projects. The titlemarks

[Anonymous]

I'm speechless