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*Don Reichle
Message 51 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 11:55 AM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
I agree with your further explanation Allen.

Extremely "scary"!

And I haven't had the necessary time to do my usual "sampling" of ALL the
posts in this particular thread at this point in time.

W-o-r-k beckons my attention, I know that's hard to believe. ;-)

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse
than training your staff,
and having them leave is -
not training your staff,
and having them stay."
Courtesy Graphics Solution Providers
----------------------------------------------------------
LDT/CD-2K4
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual 2.01GHz
XPPro 32bit SP2
2GB RAM
Dual WD800JD Hard Drives - 149GB Nvidia Stripe
Nvidia Quadro FX 1300 128MB
Dual ViewSonic 19-inch VA902b monitors


"Allen Jessup" wrote in message
news:5202825@discussion.autodesk.com...
Hi Don,

I did mention in a post to this thread this morning that it may have more
to do with the operator than the software. I'm sure that you know from
LDT/Map that the quality of the translation rests on how much time you're
willing to spend on setting everything up.

The reason I thing the Trusted DWG warning may be a good thing is Civil 3D.
With EVERYTHING kept in the drawing files I can see disaster. If your file
is damaged by inserting something that isn't compatible you may loose quite
a lot. Now (of course) we "always" have backups of all OUR drawings. But how
many post have you seen where someone is trying to recover the only version
of a file. One mistake and a whole project could be lost. I know that is in
an extreme case but it's scary none the less.

Allen

"Don Reichle" wrote in message
news:5202030@discussion.autodesk.com...
It may be likely that my friend Allen had issues with DGN files that were
converted to DWGs, after they had already been "graced" with issues from MS?

Not ever having utilized MS, I of course may be all wet with my guess re.
the "causes" of his troubles with the DWG files he mentioned.

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse
than training your staff,
and having them leave is -
not training your staff,
and having them stay."
Courtesy Graphics Solution Providers
----------------------------------------------------------
LDT/CD-2K4
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual 2.01GHz
XPPro 32bit SP2
2GB RAM
Dual WD800JD Hard Drives - 149GB Nvidia Stripe
Nvidia Quadro FX 1300 128MB
Dual ViewSonic 19-inch VA902b monitors


"Michael Kolster" wrote in message
news:5201953@discussion.autodesk.com...
I find the same thing here. We run both ACAD and MS and I use MS to open
and fix files that ACAD Audit/Restore can't fix. The file was in only used
in ACAD until then so what is so trusty about that?

Speaking of MS, if you really know how to use and configure MicroStation you
really don't have any problems. The only time I see issues with it is when
users who think they know what they are doing and say they understand MS and
then have issues with it. I set it up and use it and it works fine so is it
the software or user error?

"Don Reichle" wrote in message
news:5201893@discussion.autodesk.com...
Well I was just talking about this with other staff in the office a few
minutes ago, and our common experience was to use IntelliCAD to clean up DWG
files that had become corrupted beyond Audit/Restore process while having
been retained inside AutoCAD previously.

So that fairly well flies in the face of the post we were lead to from that
link, hmmmm?

The procedure I referred to above was c-o-n-s-i-d-e-r-a-b-l-y faster than
having to start all over from an empty dwg file, I'm sure even the Deskers
would agree.

And that would need to include the "checking" involved to make sure that all
the necessary changes had been addressed.

Which made me think of any Agency changes required - based upon the
timeframe of this unfortunate happenstance of corruption.

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse
than training your staff,
and having them leave is -
not training your staff,
and having them stay."
Courtesy Graphics Solution Providers
----------------------------------------------------------
LDT/CD-2K4
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual 2.01GHz
XPPro 32bit SP2
2GB RAM
Dual WD800JD Hard Drives - 149GB Nvidia Stripe
Nvidia Quadro FX 1300 128MB
Dual ViewSonic 19-inch VA902b monitors


wrote in message news:5201036@discussion.autodesk.com...
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=6740482
*Don Reichle
Message 52 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 11:57 AM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
I'm thinking that it's likely that you meant to type "perform" due diligence
Randy?
;-)

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse
than training your staff,
and having them leave is -
not training your staff,
and having them stay."
Courtesy Graphics Solution Providers
----------------------------------------------------------
LDT/CD-2K4
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual 2.01GHz
XPPro 32bit SP2
2GB RAM
Dual WD800JD Hard Drives - 149GB Nvidia Stripe
Nvidia Quadro FX 1300 128MB
Dual ViewSonic 19-inch VA902b monitors


wrote in message news:5202047@discussion.autodesk.com...
"" fix files that ACAD Audit/Restore can't fix. The file was in only used in
ACAD until then so what is so trusty about that? ""

Does this happen to you often? What 3rd party apps do you have loaded??

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"" Speaking of MS, if you really know how to use and configure MicroStation
you really don't have any problems. ""

There again, that depends on the version of MS and certain settings in
effect while producing the file in MSTA and the settings used for the
translation.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"" is it the software or user error? ""

Oh, without a doubt, it's pilot error. But the fault lies with the Bentley
propaganda that claims seamless transition between the two programs. It is
only seamless (not really then either) if you do due diligence in setting up
the translation. Unfortunately, many users don't, they heard it was easy, so
they just save as autocad and send me the fie. They usually get it back
that afternoon.
Distinguished Contributor
rculp
Posts: 1,235
Registered: ‎03-22-2006
Message 53 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 12:53 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
"" AutoCAD 2K7 IS 3D, previous 3D was just a funny thing. ""

ahhh, now I understand. You don't know a thing about AutoCAD. I've been doing production 3D AutoCAD for 15 years. Here we went exclusively 3D about 5 years ago with R14. Granted R2K7 will make it easier, but the say that prior releases were "just a funny thing" belies your true ignorance of the software.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"" because the new added features. It will be a pain translate it to previous AutoCAD releases and desktops, not to mention to the competition formats. ""

Happens with every release, some more so than others. But to put a finer point on it here. Compatibility with earlier releases is only a concern for those who do not (for whatever reason) keep up with the latest software. Compatibility with "other" programs is no concern at all. NONE of this has anything at all to do with Trusted DWG, save that we can now get a warning that the file is not a native AutoDESK DWG.
Distinguished Contributor
rculp
Posts: 1,235
Registered: ‎03-22-2006
Message 54 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 01:00 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
I dunno, I kinda like the "do due" part when referring to MSTA.
Distinguished Contributor
rculp
Posts: 1,235
Registered: ‎03-22-2006
Message 55 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 01:17 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
Why should AutoDESK open up their proprietary format? Show of hands here, how many are willing to give away their work product fee of charge?? The ODA just wants something for free from AutoDESK so they can avoid paying AutoDESK for their program. Doesn't sound very fair (or likely) to me. Quick, what would it benefit AutoDESK to give away their work product to the ODA??

I blame Bentley not for poor translations, but for the outright prevarications they commit in selling their product. I've read their propaganda and heard what they've told our suppliers. They have sold their software under a claim of complete translation compatibility seamless between formats, and that is just a load of bull pucky.

I don't care a whit whether Bentley and the ODA can produce a 100% translation. They just need to quit telling people they can. They apparently had difficulty competing on their own nickle, and now wish AutoDESK to freely give them the tools by which they can better compete with AutoDESK.

Does that sound remotely intelligent to you?? Would you freely give your work product to your competition so that they could better compete with you?? Judging from the number of threads I've seen here and other forums asking about locking drawing files so that people couldn't boost blocks and details, I'd say very few users would think it a good idea.
*Don Reichle
Message 56 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 02:01 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
Well now...

I can't wait to see Jorge's reply!
:-o

snip>save that we can now get a warning that the file is not a native
AutoDESK DWG.
I (for one) wish this might also occur related to the Educational version.
:-(

The "warning" portion of the snip from Randy's reply, that is.

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse
than training your staff,
and having them leave is -
not training your staff,
and having them stay."
Courtesy Graphics Solution Providers
----------------------------------------------------------
LDT/CD-2K4
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual 2.01GHz
XPPro 32bit SP2
2GB RAM
Dual WD800JD Hard Drives - 149GB Nvidia Stripe
Nvidia Quadro FX 1300 128MB
Dual ViewSonic 19-inch VA902b monitors


wrote in message news:5203406@discussion.autodesk.com...
"" AutoCAD 2K7 IS 3D, previous 3D was just a funny thing. ""

ahhh, now I understand. You don't know a thing about AutoCAD. I've been
doing production 3D AutoCAD for 15 years. Here we went exclusively 3D about
5 years ago with R14. Granted R2K7 will make it easier, but the say that
prior releases were "just a funny thing" belies your true ignorance of the
software.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"" because the new added features. It will be a pain translate it to
previous AutoCAD releases and desktops, not to mention to the competition
formats. ""

Happens with every release, some more so than others. But to put a finer
point on it here. Compatibility with earlier releases is only a concern for
those who do not (for whatever reason) keep up with the latest software.
Compatibility with "other" programs is no concern at all. NONE of this has
anything at all to do with Trusted DWG, save that we can now get a warning
that the file is not a native AutoDESK DWG.
*Don Reichle
Message 57 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 02:07 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
And for those of us ignorant of these fine points of MSTA...

Since we don't know what it is an acronym for?

Even the 1st page on Google isn't much help in regards to an Autodesk
derivative.
http://tinyurl.com/nw4hz

And the Desker Search in the Knowledge Base comes up noticeably dry also;
http://tinyurl.com/mug3n

A little help for my further enlightenment would be greatly appreciated.

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse
than training your staff,
and having them leave is -
not training your staff,
and having them stay."
Courtesy Graphics Solution Providers
----------------------------------------------------------
LDT/CD-2K4
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual 2.01GHz
XPPro 32bit SP2
2GB RAM
Dual WD800JD Hard Drives - 149GB Nvidia Stripe
Nvidia Quadro FX 1300 128MB
Dual ViewSonic 19-inch VA902b monitors


wrote in message news:5203408@discussion.autodesk.com...
I dunno, I kinda like the "do due" part when referring to MSTA.
*Tim Riley
Message 58 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 02:16 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
No, that doesn't sounds remotely intelligent to me. Autodesk owns the tool
used to create the data not the data itself. As an end user I feel I should
be able to accurately acquire my data with or without the use of an Autodesk
product. If I want to access the data via an Autodesk product, a Bentley
product or a tool of my own creation I should be able to as it is my
property.

Autodesk should take a lesson from Adobe[1].

[1] http://partners.adobe.com/public/developer/pdf/index_reference.html

--
Regards,
Tim
http://tjriley.infogami.com/pyacaddotnet


wrote in message news:5203419@discussion.autodesk.com...
Why should AutoDESK open up their proprietary format? Show of hands here,
how many are willing to give away their work product fee of charge?? The
ODA just wants something for free from AutoDESK so they can avoid paying
AutoDESK for their program. Doesn't sound very fair (or likely) to me.
Quick, what would it benefit AutoDESK to give away their work product to the
ODA??

I blame Bentley not for poor translations, but for the outright
prevarications they commit in selling their product. I've read their
propaganda and heard what they've told our suppliers. They have sold their
software under a claim of complete translation compatibility seamless
between formats, and that is just a load of bull pucky.

I don't care a whit whether Bentley and the ODA can produce a 100%
translation. They just need to quit telling people they can. They
apparently had difficulty competing on their own nickle, and now wish
AutoDESK to freely give them the tools by which they can better compete with
AutoDESK.

Does that sound remotely intelligent to you?? Would you freely give your
work product to your competition so that they could better compete with
you?? Judging from the number of threads I've seen here and other forums
asking about locking drawing files so that people couldn't boost blocks and
details, I'd say very few users would think it a good idea.
*gomez
Message 59 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 02:22 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
MSTA = Microstation ( I believe, but i not the smartest peanut in the terd)

"Don Reichle" wrote in message
news:5203541@discussion.autodesk.com...
And for those of us ignorant of these fine points of MSTA...

Since we don't know what it is an acronym for?

Even the 1st page on Google isn't much help in regards to an Autodesk
derivative.
http://tinyurl.com/nw4hz

And the Desker Search in the Knowledge Base comes up noticeably dry also;
http://tinyurl.com/mug3n

A little help for my further enlightenment would be greatly appreciated.

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse
than training your staff,
and having them leave is -
not training your staff,
and having them stay."
Courtesy Graphics Solution Providers
----------------------------------------------------------
LDT/CD-2K4
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual 2.01GHz
XPPro 32bit SP2
2GB RAM
Dual WD800JD Hard Drives - 149GB Nvidia Stripe
Nvidia Quadro FX 1300 128MB
Dual ViewSonic 19-inch VA902b monitors


wrote in message news:5203408@discussion.autodesk.com...
I dunno, I kinda like the "do due" part when referring to MSTA.
*Brian Allen
Message 60 of 152 (116 Views)

Re: What do you think about Trusted DWG?

06-12-2006 02:56 PM in reply to: JorgeLedezma
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 20:17:54 +0000, Randy Culp <> wrote:

>Why should AutoDESK open up their proprietary format? Show of hands here, how many are willing to give away their work product fee of charge?? The ODA just wants something for free from AutoDESK so they can avoid paying AutoDESK for their program. Doesn't sound very fair (or likely) to me. Quick, what would it benefit AutoDESK to give away their work product to the ODA??

Absolutely. This is nuts if you think Autodesk should give out their
file format. I'm sorry, you need to use one of "our" drawings, then
purchase the product. This isn't a .jpg here were' talking about. If
you just need to view it, get a DWF of it, or a PDF if need be. Or
better yet, go get True View (free last I knew of). Look at it to
your hearts content. But to think that I have to give you full access
to my proprietary format, well you've completely lost your mind.

I have no idea for the answer to this question as I don't know anyone
that uses Microstation, but is their drawing format open source? It
doesn't seem like good business sense to me, but hey, what do I know,
I'm not a business owner.

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