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Message 1 of 133
sbsaint
16665 Views, 132 Replies

I hate Revit

Ive been required to learn Revit, Ive been at it for 6 months now, I started on a trial version of 2009 then my company purchased 2010 and they changed so much in the two releases that I had to learn where everything was all over again, many for the worst. I find myself using other programs to model components in order to avoid the labourious and impractical procedures in Revit.

Using Revit to draft and model is like driving a car using a boatload of of push buttons rather than a steering wheel.

Ive been using 3D programs since 1995, starting with FormZ and have been using AutoCad since 2000. I think that Revit is a terrible modeler and a mediocre drafting tool. I admit that it does alot, but I have to jump through the hoops and mindset of a team of programmers who think this is the practical approach of what creating architecture should be, If this is a program that screams design, then Id rather go back to a leadholder and a Mayline. The program is NOT intuitive, and instead of me VISUALLY creating a building component with numerical parameters, Revit seems to operate in the reverse manner. Im constantly battling the Revit Gustapo dialog box that says something to the effect that my model is an illegal operation. Ever try to do a 2 path sweep? FormZ had this nailed 15 years ago, and I could easily draw any profile and the computer would do the calculations for me. Revit seems to make you work harder and not the other way around.

The interface sucks, edit parameter controls buried deep within two to three dialogue boxes. The steering wheel is a joke. Why would you make a virtual controller to replace something that your mouse already does? Its like going back to the time before they invented the joystick, and Im using the keyboard to play pac-man.

My bottom line, Revit is a chore to use, It doesnt think for you, it makes you do all the thinking. Its not fun to use at all, and it takes the wind out of your sails when trying to come up with concept designs, and has me scrambling to find a pencil. Edited by: sbsaint on Mar 24, 2010 10:53 PM
Tags (1)
132 REPLIES 132
Message 21 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

what does it say? Cause really that's what every company does.

--
Lance W.

"sbsaint" wrote in message news:6362595@discussion.autodesk.com...
> that says alot about your company, if it doesnt understand how to make
> something it just buys out the guys that do.
Message 22 of 133
sbsaint
in reply to: sbsaint

I came here hoping someone would help me out with Revit, and all ive heard are the same things. Oh you need to "spend more money on training" "Its not the softwares fault" its yours... Ive had more help from people giving their products away for free, the only thing ive seen here are salesmen. I guess 5k doesnt buy you that much from this company.
Message 23 of 133
sbsaint
in reply to: sbsaint

says alot to me. And really Not every company does.
Message 24 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

You need training, if you don't want to pay for it there are resources
online for free that will help. There are YouTube videos and self paced
pdf's, some from Autodesk that I think work just fine.

However no matter what you read or learn as long as you insist that Revit
work like any other software than Revit you will not get past your
frustration. No Revit isn't perfect but you have to deal with it as it is
not how you think it should be.

--
Lance W.

"sbsaint" wrote in message news:6362690@discussion.autodesk.com...
> I came here hoping someone would help me out with Revit, and all ive heard
> are the same things. Oh you need to "spend more money on training" "Its
> not the softwares fault" its yours... Ive had more help from people
> giving their products away for free, the only thing ive seen here are
> salesmen. I guess 5k doesnt buy you that much from this company.
Message 25 of 133
dgorsman
in reply to: sbsaint

Badmouthing a product isn't a good way to ask for help, IMO. It gives the impression that you have already judged the product as lacking and thus any help volunteered would fall on deaf ears. And you are in the wrong place; there are groups explicitly for Revit both here, AUGI, and elsewhere where you can get very specific help.

----------------------------------
If you are going to fly by the seat of your pants, expect friction burns.
"I don't know" is the beginning of knowledge, not the end.


Message 26 of 133
sbsaint
in reply to: sbsaint

So then why dont you train me, and pay my $2400 round trip ticket to go get training. This product is costing more money than the time its supposed to save.
Message 27 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

What exactly does it say to you, really? that they made a sound business
decision?

And yes it is what every company does. Anytime a company hires someone for
their knowledge or experience. It is the exact same thing on different
scales. Buying a company preserves not only the knowledge and experience of
the individuals (which is what you get by hiring someone) but of the
institution something that could take a decade or more to reproduce from
scratch

--
Lance W.

"sbsaint" wrote in message news:6362695@discussion.autodesk.com...
> says alot to me. And really Not every company does.
Message 28 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

http://www.revit-training.com/

Really do a google search before complaining you would have to fly
somewhere.

--
Lance W.

"sbsaint" wrote in message news:6362697@discussion.autodesk.com...
> So then why dont you train me, and pay my $2400 round trip ticket to go
> get training. This product is costing more money than the time its
> supposed to save.
Message 29 of 133
sbsaint
in reply to: sbsaint

perhaps, but I do think that this product really is over priced and over rated. I think that instead of putting real innovative thinking into Revit, it was over designed, cluttered, and confusing. It does alot, yet most PCs cant even handle the 50+mb files you end up with. If there are little areas to be impressed about, its overshadowed by all the hoops needed to jump through just to get your drawing right. If you think Im just rambling off, ive been counting the amount of mouse clicks it takes to do a certain task, between Revit release 2009 and 2010, and the amount of clicks has nearly doubled. What does that say about evolution? If the steering wheel was a way to relieve carpal tunnel sufferers, then someone really wasnt paying attention to the soup. Im not impressed. If anything release 2009 was alot easier to use. I know the shareware community will come out with a series of products that will be completely affordable if not free, that will be revolutionary to the way we do what we do, and im cheering them on.
Message 30 of 133
sbsaint
in reply to: sbsaint

Thank you Lance
Message 31 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

go to YouTube.com and do a search for revit 2010 and watch training videos
people have posted. Buy a book just a few good ones are paul aubins
mastering revit architecture 2010 and greg demchak mastering revit
architecture 2010. Check out the autodesk tutorials
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/pc/index?siteID=123112&id=14248298

Also there are resellers and trainers who can do training remotely with no
need to travel. I'm sure when you learned autocad or autocad architecture
you didn't pick it up in a few months and become a master at it. With revit
it will take time before you get good with it. I've read and heard people
say it takes about a year before you start becoming profitable with it.

If your main problem is with the UI changes from 2009 to 2010, then get over
it. Auotdesk has an agreement with microsoft. Both have decided to use a
ribbon interface and that is the way it will be for many release to come.
Remember this is a user supported forum and people that work for autodesk
rarely visit here and post.

wrote in message news:6362697@discussion.autodesk.com...
So then why dont you train me, and pay my $2400 round trip ticket to go get
training. This product is costing more money than the time its supposed to
save.
Message 32 of 133
dgorsman
in reply to: sbsaint

I have my doubts as to whether such a complex, complete, and flexible program could be arrived at through traditional low cost open source means. Those with the money to properly manage such development want a return in their investment resulting in the high prices you want to avoid; those without the deep pockets don't have the resources (time and/or money) to properly manage the development to get the clean, organized results.

Keep in mind the automation behind the scenes which deals with a lot of the "I" in BIM - that automation dictates the work flow that must be followed. There are always concious decisions to sacrifice potential work flow options in order to support the automation. If the freedom of work flow was allowed in certain areas then the automation would be either massive and bulky (if not outright uncodeable), leaving the end user with a bloated piece of software or manually managing the data.

I really think you may have the wrong tool for the jobs you are working on, and something much more lightweight would be appropriate.
----------------------------------
If you are going to fly by the seat of your pants, expect friction burns.
"I don't know" is the beginning of knowledge, not the end.


Message 33 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

Tell you what.

I know Revit, and you do not. You live in paradise, and I do not. You fly out
here, and come to work for my company, who will train you for free. I'll fly out
to your island paradise and use Revit on whatever grass hut designs are
required.

Matt
matt@stachoni.com

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 19:01:42 -0700, sbsaint <> wrote:

>No I havent had any Revit training as we live on an island in the south pacific. I have only been through the tutorial a dozen time which is poorly written i might add. (should I be surprised? it instructs you to find menus as if you already knew where they all are) Although you would think that 15years of doing architecture and 3D my experience would amount to something in Revit, instead it amounts to frustration and me constantly asking myself "now why did they decide to do it that way?" $5k peice of software then you need to spend more money to get training. I can tell you with the amount of share ware developers in the world these days giving thier software away for free, overpriced high learning curved platforms like Revit should have alot more brains put into the software and alot less demands of the the users.
>
>
>I know when I start my own firm, Revit will not be a part of it.
>
>Edited by: sbsaint on Mar 29, 2010 1:59 AM
Message 34 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

I'm beginning to know revit, had formal training, worked on families -
office templates etc and I'm not enamored of the interface and the limited
control one has over it. I'm starting to like the ribbon for revit - it is
simple, and clean and doesn't have too much clutter.

but other areas could be easily improved - these use of customizable
floating palettes with auto-hide, graphics, and ctrl key toggling would be
great for families

as a programmer I can see a lot of potential improvement.

I would also love to see the flexibility of a native scripting language
that would allow users the ability to really take control of the interface
and the data without having to wade through c$.net and a complicated api.


--
TDP

First things first, but not necessarily in that order.

The Doctor
"Matt Stachoni" wrote in message
news:6363074@discussion.autodesk.com...
Tell you what.

I know Revit, and you do not. You live in paradise, and I do not. You fly
out
here, and come to work for my company, who will train you for free. I'll fly
out
to your island paradise and use Revit on whatever grass hut designs are
required.

Matt
matt@stachoni.com

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 19:01:42 -0700, sbsaint <> wrote:

>No I havent had any Revit training as we live on an island in the south
>pacific. I have only been through the tutorial a dozen time which is poorly
>written i might add. (should I be surprised? it instructs you to find
>menus as if you already knew where they all are) Although you would think
>that 15years of doing architecture and 3D my experience would amount to
>something in Revit, instead it amounts to frustration and me constantly
>asking myself "now why did they decide to do it that way?" $5k peice of
>software then you need to spend more money to get training. I can tell you
>with the amount of share ware developers in the world these days giving
>thier software away for free, overpriced high learning curved platforms
>like Revit should have alot more brains put into the software and alot less
>demands of the the users.
>
>
>I know when I start my own firm, Revit will not be a part of it.
>
>Edited by: sbsaint on Mar 29, 2010 1:59 AM
Message 35 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

> I would also love to see the flexibility of a native scripting language
> that would allow users the ability to really take control of the interface
> and the data without having to wade through c$.net and a complicated api.

Hey TDP,
Would you want to have a choice of languages, or would you be content with
someone else choosing one and providing it? If you could choose a language,
what would it be? Would you expect an IDE to be built into Revit, or would
you prefer to choose your own external editor? Would you pay for scripting
language support that you could add on to Revit?

--
Bobby C. Jones
http://bobbycjones.spaces.live.com
Message 36 of 133
Alfredo_Medina
in reply to: sbsaint

Hey, Dave said that the fact that you live in a very far island in the Pacific is not an excuse for not finding training. If you can connect to this newsgroup, you can connect to online classes, too. So, you have no need to reply to Dave with that attitude. You are behind in news if you think you have to fly these days to get training.

sbsaint wrote:

> So then why dont you train me, and pay my $2400 round trip ticket to go get training.

Alfredo Medina _________________________________________________________________ ______
Licensed Architect (Florida) | Freelance Instructor | Autodesk Expert Elite (on Revit) | Profile on Linkedin
Message 37 of 133
paul.ashley
in reply to: sbsaint

Re: "It seems like Autodesk didnt pay attention to any of that when they made Revit."

Programmers from Pro-Engineer created Revit, not Autodesk, and that, along with the totally different paradigm between Revit and AutoCAD perhaps contributed to the interface issue. I agree that the UI is cumbersome in Revit and has been somewhat unfriendly from the very beginning.

It is surprising that Revit has made use of right-click context-sensitive pop-up menus so ubiquitous in AutoCAD. It would make the transition between the two programs easier. Even with Revit version 3, I was always forgetting to look up at the menu bar to see what my options were for the particular command invoked. The use of the ribbon, in both AutoCAD and Revit (something required by Autodesk's association with Microsoft ?) makes it even harder to get used to.

Comparing Revit to other 3D modeling programs may not be a fair comparison since Revit set out to not only model but to produce traditional 2d documents from the model and provide information for downstream use. 3ds, Rhino, Sketchup and FormZ don't do that and if they attempted to, it's possible their interface would have to change due the added complexity. While I haven't used software for product design and manufacturing such as Solidworks and Inventor, how would you compare those modeling interfaces with Revit?

In my small architecture world, working as I do for a company that creates prototype buildings meant to be built over and over again with small modifications, and that has a desire to track materials costs and maintain the buildings, revit makes sense. The interface may be something we just have to "get over" while we push for improvements.
Message 38 of 133
paul.ashley
in reply to: sbsaint

At Autodesk University there was a presentation on using Revit for conceptual design. I wasn't able to attend but think that the focus was on getting users to realize that all of the data Revit can hold doesn't need to be entered up front. That may or may not solve you issue with the Revit UI and it's rules for object relationships, it might be a useful read. The presentation could probably be found on the AU website.
Message 39 of 133
J.A.Mounteer
in reply to: sbsaint

The folks here are end users and CAD managers, not Autodesk Representatives. Your complaint about salespeople and not getting enough for your 5k is irrelevant in this forum. Speak with your reseller about that.

Snarkiness aside, your mistake is assuming that Autodesk made Revit and changed the way they did things "just because." They did not. As Paul pointed out they bought the software company that wrote it and have been developing it since.

Approach it from the standpoint that once again you're a complete novice and don't know half of what you think you do. The same as learning any other new software program, be it a word processor, a billing program or CAD system. You know the basics of what it's capable of and nothing beyond that.
Message 40 of 133
Anonymous
in reply to: sbsaint

The only person that I knew who used Revit is doing time in the Federal
Pen. Apparently he believed that the government did not have a legal
right to make him pay income tax, and that the court where he was tried
had no jurisdiction. Maybe not, but it didn't stop them from locking him
up. Similarly if you don't like Revit, it won't force Autodesk to change
it or to stop producing it just to satisfy one disenchanted user.

No software is perfect, no computer is perfect, no user is perfect. Add
these up and you realize that you need to learn that improve what is
within your power such as your skills.

On 3/31/2010 2:51 PM, J.A.Mounteer wrote:
> The folks here are end users and CAD managers, not Autodesk Representatives. Your complaint about salespeople and not getting enough for your 5k is irrelevant in this forum. Speak with your reseller about that.
>
> Snarkiness aside, your mistake is assuming that Autodesk made Revit and changed the way they did things "just because." They did not. As Paul pointed out they bought the software company that wrote it and have been developing it since.
>
> Approach it from the standpoint that once again you're a complete novice and don't know half of what you think you do. The same as learning any other new software program, be it a word processor, a billing program or CAD system. You know the basics of what it's capable of and nothing beyond that.

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