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Bentley One-ups Autodesk

84 REPLIES 84
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Message 1 of 85
Anonymous
662 Views, 84 Replies

Bentley One-ups Autodesk

Check out what Bentley is doing with Google Earth.

Autodesk products prevent customers from using web
technology. Other vendors who may have been thinking they have nothing to
lose are beginning to show customers what they are missing. What is the
Autodesk response? Upgrade to 2007 because now you can actually print to
pdf! Whoopee.

<%= Clinton Gallagher
NET csgallagher AT metromilwaukee.com
URL http://clintongallagher.metromilwaukee.com/ Message was edited by: Discussion Admin
84 REPLIES 84
Message 41 of 85
JeffreyMcGrew
in reply to: Anonymous

You know, I see the Revit developers chime in on the Revit newsgroup (as well on AUGI) often enough to be a nice thing. I've seen some of the ADT guys chime in too, from time to time. So maybe it's just the Civil team that doesn't hang out on the newsgroups.

I mean, I've seen very technical questions about Revit's internal structure answered by one of the two founders and creators over on AUGI. I agree that it's very nice to be able to get that insite from the people responsible for the tools you're using as to why it works the way it does...
Message 42 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

they are all on the civil3d board.

Probably the most active AutoCAD newsgroup that I monitor (out of ten).

although the 2007 group will probably surpass it shortly.........


wrote in message news:5122999@discussion.autodesk.com...
So maybe it's just the Civil team that doesn't hang out on the newsgroups.
Message 43 of 85
JeffreyMcGrew
in reply to: Anonymous

woops, sorry. I don't hang out in the civil groups, so I took for granted what was posted above. Good to know the developers do hang out there. It really can make a world of difference.

Then again to take anything for granted on a thread started by this bozo certainly makes me the idiot, huh? 😉
Message 44 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

JeffreyMcGrew wrote:
> woops, sorry. I don't hang out in the civil groups, so I took for
> granted what was posted above. Good to know the developers do hang
> out there. It really can make a world of difference.
>
> Then again to take anything for granted on a thread started by this
> bozo certainly makes me the idiot, huh? 😉

It's just that the trolls aren't smart enough to figure out that when
somebody puts "Autodesk" after their names on this board, it's not just
the software that they're using 😉

--
Jason Hickey

http://beneaththelines.blogspot.com
Message 45 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

If you are posting from the newsgroup side, it is easy to block a sender. I
never saw the original post that started this thread, or any of his
subsequent remarks, but I do see replies from others.

At present, he has the sole honor of being my only blocked sender in the
AutoDesk.com newsgroups.

Somebody has to get pretty foul to make me block, but anti-Semitic comments
will usually trigger that response immediately (happened maybe a year ago).

wrote in message news:5123456@discussion.autodesk.com...
Message 46 of 85
rculp
in reply to: Anonymous

"" At present, he has the sole honor of being my only blocked sender in the AutoDesk.com newsgroups ""

I think I'm flattered 😉
But hey, that's just me.

Randall Culp
Civil-Structural Design Technician
(aka CADaver)
Message 47 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I haven't even thought about blocking your posts.
After all things already said, I do have some pretty low standards. 😉

wrote in message news:5123958@discussion.autodesk.com...
"" At present, he has the sole honor of being my only blocked sender in the
AutoDesk.com newsgroups ""

I think I'm flattered 😉
Message 48 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

You tell them Sensai!
Message 49 of 85
tkdkid1
in reply to: Anonymous

I've been a technical editor and author on books about Microstation and AutoCAD and also used both and their many incarnations on projects from 40,000 sheets to 15 sheets and AutoCAD wins hands down!
Message 50 of 85
rculp
in reply to: Anonymous

While I've never written a book, I have spent the last 2 decades working with both, and I have to agree.
But hey, that's just me.

Randall Culp
Civil-Structural Design Technician
(aka CADaver)
Message 51 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

While I have only used Autodesk products, I will agree too.....just for teh
sake of keeping it peaceful and unanimuous for a change.

Jack Talsky


wrote in message news:5128789@discussion.autodesk.com...
While I've never written a book, I have spent the last 2 decades working
with both, and I have to agree.
Message 52 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I'll agree to.
When I was going to school they required you to take a class with
Microstation and AutoCad2000.
Breezed right through AutoCAD but had to put in alot of study time to just
get the basics of microstation.
Only got a C for microstation and got an A in AutoCAD


"Turbo" wrote in message
news:5128884@discussion.autodesk.com...
While I have only used Autodesk products, I will agree too.....just for teh
sake of keeping it peaceful and unanimuous for a change.

Jack Talsky


wrote in message news:5128789@discussion.autodesk.com...
While I've never written a book, I have spent the last 2 decades working
with both, and I have to agree.
Message 53 of 85
Steve_Stafford
in reply to: Anonymous

Having used both over several years including both at the same time, also helping users of each learn either I'd say they both are a pain in the bottom. Neither is the least bit intuitive, folks have been using one or the other long enough that they don't remember what a pain it was to learn in the first place. Either that or they can't bring themselves to admit it 8-)

Microstation user...why doesn't my middle button work? When told to set variable "mbuttonpan" to 1...reply WHAT???WHY???

AutoCAD user...I have to use a "chord"??? (right button and left button simultaneaous) WHAT/WHY? Tenative? Select? huh? I have to pick a pick tool???
Message 54 of 85
tkdkid1
in reply to: Anonymous

i say both are seriously outdated! it's hard to believe we're stuck with lines, arcs and circles after so many years. Heck aviation went from the wright flyer to the moon in 63 years. but here we are 22 years later still using the AutoDesk etch-i-sketch. What's up with that microstation design plane? at least in autocad you can chisel your design into place without it falling through the cracks.

I guess we can blame marketing? as long as nobody else steps up with decent software we the users will always get screwed. Autocad and microstation are the Lotus 123 of drafting right now. it will be interesting to see what happens. maybe autodesk will do a techonology turn around similar to microsoft's internet redirection.

face it we get no decent color support in autocad. no decent plotting for sets of drawings. no real drawing manager. no real text. no real integration in ms office. no real web tools. no real change management. collaborative design? and on and on.

the technology is so bad we can't even get a decent electronic file from any client - not even very large international clients that have huge budgets and large staffs. when did a drawing ever show up with everything on the correct layer with correct symbology? blocks? placed right? not some exploded, some not, some mirrored weird, all attributes correct and filed out for takeoffs?

of course the solution is your handy-dandy uber-customization ability. heck we even get a programming language so we can write all those missing functions we use every 2 seconds.

now we're getting tons of different products - the shotgun approach to product development. can't do it in autocad, how about architectural desktop, did you try revit, maybe it'd work in inventor, oh, jeez you gotta do that in another $2500 program called 3DS max. so now i want to see it online? arruuugghhh!

at the rate both companies move at least my career path isn't very challenging - grin. i'll be retired before seeing any disruptive technology. of course if autodesk and microstation had it together would i have a job? i don't need to actually know anything except autodesk software! I'm truly a robotic technical geek - all i have to know is a particular software application. I guess that makes me an application specialist. so who's complaining?
Message 55 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

sounds like you are still using R13.

Down load 2007 for a free 30 day trial.

Jack Talsky
Message 56 of 85
tkdkid1
in reply to: Anonymous

already there with the latest and greatest! just started! i know folks that still use R12!

both autocad and microstation have changed over the years. I started with autocad in 1985 with the version just before the locked out one. i started with microstation when it was IGDS and only on a mainframe.

changes have been evolutionary - all most the same time scale - the technology has not fundamentally changed since the initial versions were created.
Message 57 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Neither program can go through major User Interface changes because then
other users complain that it doesn't look and work like it used to. So it's
really a double edged sword for any software developer. When do you wipe
the slate clean to make it easier for new users and when do you make minor
changes (like tool pallettes) and keep it familar to existing users?

In Microstation I still don't understand the Cell concept. Isn't a cell
something you type a number into in a spreadsheet? I've toyed with
Microstation but as far as being any easier to use then AutoCAD I don't see
it.

Overall I feel that AutoCAD really isn't that bad. But then again I learned
how to use it as a freshman in high school back when screen menus were the
big thing.

I use Illustrator 10 for marketing and magazine ads and I don't know how in
the hell people don't go out of their mind using that program. I tried
Corel and that wasn't any better. I took me an hour to figure out how to
insert a file. How intuitive is it for Windows users to use File->Place to
do it or to even right-click and not have Copy/Cut/Paste commands. Sure to
Mac users it might make sense but I'm using a Windows version. I still have
yet to figure out how to change the radius on a rounded rectangle or even
how to select all text that uses the same font. Either of which take a few
seconds in AutoCAD

Cars have gotten all kinds of fancy features over the years but they still
have a round steering wheel and gas and break pedals. The steering wheel is
still on the left hand side even though it would be safer in head on
collisions to be on the right hand side. It would also make it safer for
the driver to get out when parallel parked and probably give you a better
field of view for deer or animals jumping out in front of you. But there's
other reasons for it on the left and it's not likely to change in the US.

--
Rodney McManamy
President
CADzation
-------------------------
rmcmanamy@cadzation.com
-------------------------
518 South Route 31 Suite 200
McHenry, IL 60050
http://www.cadzation.com
Providing Industrial Strength
PDF & DWF Solutions to the
Global CAD Marketplace.

wrote in message news:5129414@discussion.autodesk.com...
already there with the latest and greatest! just started! i know folks that
still use R12!

both autocad and microstation have changed over the years. I started with
autocad in 1985 with the version just before the locked out one. i started
with microstation when it was IGDS and only on a mainframe.

changes have been evolutionary - all most the same time scale - the
technology has not fundamentally changed since the initial versions were
created.
Message 58 of 85
rculp
in reply to: Anonymous

The core program for AutoCAD has gone through 3 or 4 full re-writes in the last dozen years to keep up with hardware/software improvements and user demands.

MSTA's only re-write was between V7 and V8, when they finally understood that "connect-the-dots" was fine for kiddy coloring books, but was lunacy for CAD accuracy.

BTW, IGDS on a main frame was NOT MicroStation, But InterGraph. Two vastly different programs.
But hey, that's just me.

Randall Culp
Civil-Structural Design Technician
(aka CADaver)
Message 59 of 85
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Where do you get this stuff?

As far as can tell, I have never seen anyone publish anything about version
adoption. Bentley being a private company are not releasing it so are you
just pulling numbers from your rear? Most companys I do business with use
V8 and most of those are ready to move to XM.

wrote in message news:5121596@discussion.autodesk.com...
Bentley has to support older versions, it 2/3 their market share.
Message 60 of 85
rculp
in reply to: Anonymous

A company that does MSTA resale and support in the Houstom area estimates that bewteen 60% and 70% of the MSTA users in the Houston market are running less than current versions. The Bentley website in 2002 claimed that between 55% and 65% of their user base waited at least 2 years to upgrade. Of the 6 clients we currently have, none are running V8, one is on V7 and the rest are earlier.
But hey, that's just me.

Randall Culp
Civil-Structural Design Technician
(aka CADaver)

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