Create roof / floor using work plane ???

[Anonymous]

Help! please.

I need to create a sloped roof. I want to base this roof upon a beam system created using a sloped workplane rather than offset from a level. I now understand that (for some reason) Revit will not create floors or roofs using work planes, but only on levels, and I know that I can create a flat roof on a level and apply slope arrows and adjust the offset height, etc. etc. but that is very imprecise (lots of micro adjustments) and a lot of steps.

Isn't there any way to create a floor or roof using a work plane as the level?

The attached image shows a roof I created "by face" from a box mass element I set on the plane - unfortuately now I cannot edit the outline to get it to fint my non-rectangular roof.

Can anyone set me on the right path? Thank you.

Shawn

[Anonymous]

You can use Roof by Extrusion. Go to a side elevation or section view, and sketch the profile then create roof.

Then in Plan you can adjust the depth. You may also then need to use a Void to trim the roof to the irregular shape of the footprint.

Another method would be Roof by Footprint, and then use Edit Points to set heights at the various corners in Plan.

[Anonymous]

Thank you for your input - both valid suggestions. Unfortunately not as clean or accurate as what I was hoping for. The point editing tool doesn't seem to work on sloped surfaces - you need a flat floor to start with - and not available for roofs. (?)

I was able to create the roof with basic roof modeling methods, level offset and slope arrow adjusments - and it's close, but the roof doesn't really connect to the plane if you zoom in close enough you can see they are not perfectly aligned or mated.

Seems like Autodesk should take a look at this unless it's some fundamental issue with the program. After all, most commercial roofs are exactly what I'm trying to model - a variably solped surface below a parapet wall.

[Alfredo_Medina]

I don't see anything complicated in the roof that you show in the .doc file. Could you provide an image of desired floor plan and elevation?

[Anonymous]

You are correct - it's not the least bit complicated, which is why I am surprised that I can't do what I want.

The floor plan below the roof is bascially open. The structure is a transportation terminal for a bus company. The only structural elemment that is non-standard is that the engineer decided to slope the roof framing (beams and purlins) rather than slope the roof insulation for run-off.

I created the roof structure using a beam system along a ref. plane - I thought I would be able to model the roof (metal deck and rigid insulation) on top of this, but neither the roof or floor tool is set up to use reference planes and the slope arrow and level offest method is a bit hit and miss.

The roofing finish is done, but not really mated to the structure - if you don't get too close you can't tell - I just wasted a bit of time trying to figure out how to use the reference plane to model the roof.

Thanks for your interest.

SG

[Anonymous]

Did you try Roof by Extrusion?  

Another possibility would be to create a Mass, then apply Roof by Face to the sloped face of the Mass.

The Slope Arrow method or Edit by Points both work very well, we have done hundreds of these roofs in past projects.

[Alfredo_Medina · Accepted solution]

---

@Anonymous wrote:

Help! please....

Isn't there any way to create a floor or roof using a work plane as the level?

---

Yes, but in a different workflow or sequence. If I understand correctly, you are doing the beams system first, and then you want to do the roof. Change the sequence. Do the roof first, create a reference plane that is aligned and locked to the roof, then, set a view that is perpendicular to that reference plane, and use that to sketch the beam system. Now, if the slope of the roof changes, the reference plane will folow the slope, and the beam system will follow the reference plane.,

[Anonymous]

Thank you,

I did try using the mass creation method as described in my original post -the problem was that my roof has a cut corner and the roof created from the "box" mass did not allow me to edit the form.

The extrusion method has the same limitation (I think). Having to use voids to get your geometry correct sounds like a potentiall messy and overly involved solution.

Using the edit point tools only seems to apply to floor elements - I guess I could make the roof from a generic floor and edit - but more to the point, from what I read, there seems to be serious limitations with editing points regarding how far the points can be moved and how complex the shape can be???

My basic problem is that I am only boderline competent in revit, most of my work being done in Autocad. I'm sure there are perfectly acceptable ways to do what I want, but they are not straight forward and require using a mutiple set of tools in the box that I just haven't used enought to be proficient with.

I would love to take a few advanced classed - but the training is just waaaaay toooooo expensive for me. I don't have a corporate overlord to pick up the tab.

Thanks again for your suggestions.

SG

[Anonymous]

Wow! Brilliant thank you. That makes perfect sense.

Gracias.

SG

[Anonymous]

You can easily edit points of a Roof.

see attached.

(Alf's method is also a good one, when using a Beam System with a Ref. Plane.)

cheers

[Alfredo_Medina]

Here's a quick video, (the roof and beam system already created)

http://screencast.com/t/pLuGI5bR3

[Anonymous]

Alf,

True once the roof is modeled, add the sloped ref. plane and the roof and beam system will follow.

But this still doesn't explain how to model the roof, does it?

(unless I'm missing something?)

[Alfredo_Medina]

Oh, the roof can be a simple roof with Roof by Footprint and slopes, as normal. The beam system is the one that needs to be created from a 3d view, using Orient to plane. Then you pick lines of the walls, and Revit will find the projection of those lines on the sloped reference plane.

[Anonymous]

Apparently you are correct. The edit points tool is available for roofs- however, my roof is sloped and the edit points tools doesn't show up when I select it - which is why I didn't see it the first time.

I will try the edit points method just for educational purposes, but apparntly I will have to start with a new flat roof element. Thank you.

sg

[Alfredo_Medina]

If it's a simple slope, a roof by footprint with a slope in one side only should be enough. I don't understand the need for editing points.

[Anonymous]

One use of Edit Points--To set the roof to precise elevations where the steel supports are located below the roof,

or for crickets around penetrations on sloping roofs, or for tapered insulation.

In the OP's case--a simple "defines slope" in sketch mode, or a Slope Arrow would probably suffice.

Just showing him the possibilities Revit offers for other situations as well.

[Anonymous]

If the edit points tool works for my application.... the only value or need for it would be to have more control over the interface between the structural elements and the roof element. I have found it difficult to edit the slope accurately enough to align the roof with the structural elements below.

Your suggestion to reverse the work flow solves that issue, but if for some reason I have to model the structure first, then the edit points tool might be best. I don't know, I haven't tried it yet.

You are both right. Thank you.

[Anonymous]

PS - ccollins makes a good point with respect to tapered insulation. My roof is a simple slope, but it will also have tapered insluation to roof drains.... which I haven't tackled yet due to trying to figure out the basic roof.

Again, thank you both for your excellent contributions.

Shawn Graham

Modern Building Systems Inc.

[Alfredo_Medina]

In my opinion, the Editing points option is good in the cases that Cliff has mentioned. I would not recommended as a tool to start the creation of a roof with a simple constant, slope, because it can create issues with incorrect thickness. If that's the case, simply use roof by footprint.

[Anonymous]

Hi Shawn! I think I've found what you where looking for. Now I know it's a long time ago (relatively), but for future projects I would assume this is what you want. Look at the video and after 1 minute and 30 seconds or so you'll see what I mean.
http://revitoped.blogspot.dk/2013/05/three-minutes-with-floor-sloping.html