Revit & 3D Plant

[Pitstop1825]

Wish they actually worked together!

At the moment i have tried exporting plant to autocad then into revit, which results in all the plant information aperring in whatever section I cut no matter if the detail should or shouldnt be seen

or

if I export my structure from revit to cad and then bring that into plant it results in lots of lines appearing in the orthos which I have to explode the blocks to get rid of.

lots of work either way which is not what i would expect from packages of software sold as a design suite!

[Bernd.Gerstenberger]

Hi Danny,

I'm sorry for your experience here. Yes, we can improve the exchange of data between those applications and we do. It is already in our enhancement list to use the IFC-format in Plant 3D for import and export to improve the exchange with Revit.

Regards

Bernd

[Pitstop1825]

Hi Bernd,

Thanks for the reply but …

Could you please explain further? is this import/export of data available now via some extension or similar that i have missed? or will it be available in a forth coming release?

What is Autodesk’s expected workflow?

I am desperately in search of a way forward on a live project and can only see 2 options

• do everything in Revit (taking advantage of the structural 3D model already produced and the 3d model collaboration from the architect.) unfortunately this will require producing a fair few mass in place objects or families 
• do everything in Plant 3D (see if I can salvage what I can from Revit, hope it doesn’t change and potentially reproduce anything from the architects 3d model in Plant 3D)

If anyone else has experience of using Plant and Revit on a project and has any workarounds they would be greatly appreciated

Regards

[ybogdanov]

You can use SDNF files for export/import structure from Plant to Revit. For this you need install extension pack for Revit structure from subsription center. I use it for structure calculation.

Regards

[aaronkromm9890]

You may have found a solution to this by now as this post was a bit ago but I'll give you my thoughts.

If i'm understanding your question correctly.  You are simply just trying to be able to import your plant 3d model into Revit and have your plant 3d model obey the section clip planes/depths.  If this is so my work around is to use the "exporttoautocad" command in plant 3d and then open the exported cad file and blow away any unnecessary xrefs that might have been still attached.  Then you need to select all the 3d content in the drawing and make it a block.  Once you have done this you can open Revit and create a family.  In this family you will "Insert" the cad file that you exported.  I will usually make sure this gets inserted as "automatic - origin to origin".  Once finished you just need to load the family into your revit project. 

While this is cumbersome the resulting revit family you create will obey section clipping as long as the family category is "General Model".  Autodesk really needs to make it work such that we can just link the original Plant 3d DWG model file as any other ordinary cad file.  If we could just link the cad file and have it behave properly then coordination between disciplines would be alot better as they would be working from a "LIVE" model and not something that has to be exported.  Autodesk I strongly recommend this be worked on for the next release.

Aaron

[jeremiah.bowles]

This would work but Plant 3D does not have an IFC export.

[VERD1]

Almost 2 years and 2 releases on from the date of posting, and still Autodesk have failed to resolve this issue.

As a founder member of IAI (buildingSMART - Webpage Quote: "buildingSMART International aims to provide rigorous software certification, user verification and compliance programs to the minimum level needed to assure the marketplace and adequately support user uptake. We will franchise these compliance schemes world wide."); Autodesk should by now have championed interoperability within its own software as a priority. Yet Plant 3D still does not comply as certified software and therefore provide the "minimum level needed......".

How long can users afford to wait?

[MJ]

in our company we have an related problem with Plant 3D and IFC-modells:

We are constructing and calculating buildings with Allplan in 3D (intelligent IFC-Modell) and have to use a broken export to .dwg to be able to do the piping inside the buildings in Plant 3D. You can rarely get imformations back the other way arround and it´s getting worse when you have to set up 2D plans with details from both, piping and building...

Any supported ifc import/export in Plant 3D would really help simplify our workflow while reducing place for mistakes same time.

[Ian_Spencer]

The question regarding IFC output from Plant 3D has been raised before in 2013 and was then identified as being on the enhanced list to include in future releases, how long is this list?

Please advise if you intend to incorporate IFC import and export into Plant 3D, Yes or No?

Please advise the exact date you will incorporate the file extension?

I believe that there are too many questions about this topic and all that your valuable customers would like to here yes or no and date expected.

What I don't understand is how Autodesk can introduce a software package that does not support IFC file types when you originally created the format? Even if you purchase a piece of software surely you check first as to the "interoperability".

I look forward hearing whether the Plant 3D software is BIM compliant or not?

[dgorsman]

AutoDesk cannot discuss specific development plans or release dates.  Part of that is legal (rules for publicly held companies) part of that is practical (what happens if they can't do it as planned, or can't meet the released date?).  Even those non-AutoDeskers in the BETA programs who get an early heads up are bound by non-disclosure agreements.

BIM is a process, not a program, so it is what you make of it.  It may not go to the extents of Revit but can still be considered BIM as it does store and manage data in the models.

[Ian_Spencer]

The documents binding standardisation should not refer to common file types such as IFC, which after some investigation seems to be the only answer. Maybe I misunderstood but I believed BIM to be the answer of managing a project from start to finish sharing information along the way, so the idea is to have an open solution?

How can everyone work in a colabrative environment when IFC seems to be the only option?

Back to the software issue, you state;

BIM is a process, not a program, so it is what you make of it.  It may not go to the extents of Revit but can still be considered BIM as it does store and manage data in the models.

The Plant 3D software may store a lot more information than Revit but provides no way of sharing it in the IFC format which is being requested by clients, before you say its the clients preference for file type (IFC), as I stated earlier I believe this is the only option available. I believe Autodesk concentrates on interoperability, so should file types that Buildingsmart certify, not be available in all software that Autodesk sell?

Its funny how you mention Revit as a better solution, from an MEP point of view it is the only software that currently produces certified IFC exports.

Are you suggesting that we should all ditch every other piece of software and replace it with Revit MEP which does not provide the functions offered in other software such as Plant 3D? In this instance I am refering to the interaction between P&ID and drawing the 3D model which reduces drafting mistakes and when setup correctly a lot of time.

I would like to know if there is a plan to introduce IFC export to Plant 3D?

Or are you aware of an alternative solution to IFC or a certified work around?

[dgorsman]

I made no mention of switching to Revit.  While it manages much more data than Plant3D it is unsuited for process plant design.  It was only for comparison as "The" product considered to be BIM.

P&ID <=> model communication benefits are frequently overblown.  The amount of work needed to get it working well outweigh any derived benefits.  Hours saved is easily wiped out in extra time needed to manage/input that data and work around limitations.  I know - I've been there on several projects with a variety of software.  In short I have *never* seen it work out even when well managed with a huge support team.

Interoperability isn't as simple as clicking a toggle.  There's a *lot* of work which goes into making it possible, and in doing so frequently puts a straightjacket around future development.  P&ID <=> model links are a good example.  In order for it to work the P&IDs must be done a certain way, no exceptions.  That takes more time, and inevitably requires developing work-arounds for situations not accounted for.

[djc1984]

Any updates on the plant3D export to IFC?

I require an IFC to perform rule based checking.  IFC is the only really valid option for rule based checking to work.

The model needs data intelligence, not a dumb DWG version that does not know where it is or what it is.

[christopher.bennettXRE2B]

Any updates concerning this issue, our Customer wants everything done in revit but he also wants isos. We were hoping to do the piping in plant 3d.

[TomislavGolubovic]

You could use a NWD as an XREF of the Revit file.

[lucy.jensen]

Hello - is it possible to now export Plant space 3D models into IFC format???

This post saying it was not possible is from 2013 - I was wondering if there was now a way

Thanks

Lucy