Detailed Design Complete. Plant 3D issues

[thebearjed]

Autocad Plant 3D Suite 2012 Issues

After completing a project using Autocad Plant 3D I have run across the following issues that have not been resolved or items that program can not reproduce.

P&ID

• Flanges should match layer/linetype of parent line. When printing the flanges do not match the thickness of parent line.
• Need an option to show a flanged valve with 1 or 0 flanges attached. For instance when placing a flanged valve and needing to put a blind flange on one end. or when placing a flanged valve directly on a nozzle.
• When setting the valve tag to use “Last Valve Number Used” and you erase a valve the counter does not reset. If you place another valve the count skips a number and you have to manually reset the counter.

Plant 3D

• Would like the ability to keep equipment models between inventor and plant 3D dynamic.
• Would like the ability to add spec and line number to equipment nozzles.
• When switching workspaces tool pallets, toolbars, ect…reset
• Larger library needed for control valve actuators.
• Would like the ability to rotate valve handwheels independently from valve.
• When adding a nozzle to custom equipment the whole piece of equipment stays highlighted, minor but confusing.
• PlantConnectJoint command does not work.
• Would like the ability to place elbows/tees by center.
• When accessing the pulldown for line numbers if you select turn all line numbers on to stay that way.
• When placing flow arrows or any other iso annotations they should be on the same layer as the selected line so that when isolating a line you do not have all of the floating iso annotations.
• I have found that the dimension of 3000lb 90 ell and tee are different. Industry standard says this should be the same. This does not instill confidence in the rest of the dimensions being correct and I do not have the time to check all these dimensions.

Isometrics

• Would like spool tags to be larger and/or double lined to stand out more, or have the ability to edit the spool tags in project manager.
• When placing an edit location you cannot edit it to say anything?
• Force iso onto one sheet does not work.
• If investing in the program long term there will be a need for a stand alone iso program.
• Spool not produced because if iso message. Erase iso message in model and iso is produced?
• Spool Ansi B does not dimension location of olets.
• Would like the ability to rename isos in project manager.
• Flex hose and flow meter placed as custom objects does not get called on BOM.
• Would like the ability to suppress dimensions on vents and drains. This I not necessary and clouds up the iso.
• Greater level of control desired for iso program in general. See isogen.

Orthos

• Need better interface for annotating orthos.
• Need the ability to annotate centerline and bottom of pipe elevations.
• Need the ability to annotate instrumentation.

[ybogdanov]

P&ID

• Flanges should match layer/linetype of parent line. When printing the flanges do not match the thickness of parent line.  I'm agree!

• Need an option to show a flanged valve with 1 or 0 flanges attached. For instance when placing a flanged valve and needing to put a blind flange on one end. or when placing a flanged valve directly on a nozzle. It's posible to creat blind flange and connect it to the one valve port.
• When setting the valve tag to use “Last Valve Number Used” and you erase a valve the counter does not reset. If you place another valve the count skips a number and you have to manually reset the counter. I'm agree!

Plant 3D

• Would like the ability to keep equipment models between inventor and plant 3D dynamic.  I'm agree!
• Would like the ability to add spec and line number to equipment nozzles. I'm agree!
• When switching workspaces tool pallets, toolbars, ect…reset You need to save workspace with any name and is no't will be changed.
• Larger library needed for control valve actuators. You can creat your own library in catalog editor. And if you don't like the form of existing actuators is posible to insert any 3D solid object as actuator.
• Would like the ability to rotate valve handwheels independently from valve. It's posible with blue arrows when the valve is selected.
• When adding a nozzle to custom equipment the whole piece of equipment stays highlighted, minor but confusing. 
• PlantConnectJoint command does not work. It's work but is necessary have objects in the correct position, if you have slope pipes, is necessary to install Service Pack 1 for Plant3D. The correct position is that objects need to be perfectly allined, if the pipe or flange has any rotation in any axis and other object don't has the same rotation the objects don't will be jointed.
• Would like the ability to place elbows/tees by center. Normally for to do this, I create the elbow or tee in the space of the model, and then move it with the AutoCAD command MOVE from center node.
• When accessing the pulldown for line numbers if you select turn all line numbers on to stay that way.
• When placing flow arrows or any other iso annotations they should be on the same layer as the selected line so that when isolating a line you do not have all of the floating iso annotations. I'm agree!
• I have found that the dimension of 3000lb 90 ell and tee are different. Industry standard says this should be the same. This does not instill confidence in the rest of the dimensions being correct and I do not have the time to check all these dimensions. I'm agree! I usually revise all dimensions before start the project...

[ybogdanov]

Isometrics

• Would like spool tags to be larger and/or double lined to stand out more, or have the ability to edit the spool tags in project manager. Spool tags are AutoCAD blocks which is modificable from Project Setup.
• When placing an edit location you cannot edit it to say anything?
• Force iso onto one sheet does not work. It's work, in the cases when is not work you need to revise the pipe, because it will be disconnect in any point. Hovever I had in one project this proble with only one pipe which were connected and the force iso didn't working, the solution were use the QUICKISO and selected manually all pipe.
• If investing in the program long term there will be a need for a stand alone iso program.
• Spool not produced because if iso message. Erase iso message in model and iso is produced?
• Spool Ansi B does not dimension location of olets.  You can create your own type of representation for isos in project setup and configure all this things.
• Would like the ability to rename isos in project manager. Changing TAG of Line group in Project Manager. Or more simply "Save as .." And save it to another folder.
• Flex hose and flow meter placed as custom objects does not get called on BOM. Revise propertie LongDescription Size of the objects.
• Would like the ability to suppress dimensions on vents and drains. This I not necessary and clouds up the iso. In the Project setup go to the title setup, and than it will be changed in the themes styles (I don't remember exactly the name of the bottom)
• Greater level of control desired for iso program in general. See isogen. 

Orthos  Is posible to configure all this things manually but I think that Autodesk need to do better the ortho interface generally, because now it don't have nothing default.

• Need better interface for annotating orthos.
• Need the ability to annotate centerline and bottom of pipe elevations.
• Need the ability to annotate instrumentation.

[PeterQuinn]

Curious about this point -

• If investing in the program long term there will be a need for a stand alone iso program.

Can you explain this need a little more? What's your workflow with isos? Will being able to read in a PCF in Plant 3D and create an iso (which is possible now) be sufficient? Also, we have a web app on Autodesk Labs where you can create an iso from a PCF. When it's fully functional and configurable, would a web app like this be suitable?

[thebearjed]

while i am sure that would be a nice addition, what i mean by a stand alone iso program is something more like cadpipe iso or bentley isometrics. a program where you do not have a 3D model to pull from but you can draw isometrics totally independant of any other program.

sometimes it is necessary to quickly produce an iso and we don't have the time to do a 3D model or set up a new project. also after isos have been produced from a 3D model and cleaned up there may be some changes to the project. if it is a small change it would be quicker and eaiser to edit the iso rather than go through the whole process of producing and cleaning up a new iso.

[jenakap1]

Is that something you can do with plain AutoCAD or AutoCAD WS?  The web service Peter mentioned available on labs today lets you view/edit iso's in AutoCAD WS.  Do you think that gives you what you are looking for?

[thebearjed]

no sir.

[thebearjed]

P&ID

• Flanges should match layer/linetype of parent line. When printing the flanges do not match the thickness of parent line.  I'm agree!

• Need an option to show a flanged valve with 1 or 0 flanges attached. For instance when placing a flanged valve and needing to put a blind flange on one end. or when placing a flanged valve directly on a nozzle. It's posible to creat blind flange and connect it to the one valve port. NOT ON A DUAL FLANGED VALVE
• When setting the valve tag to use “Last Valve Number Used” and you erase a valve the counter does not reset. If you place another valve the count skips a number and you have to manually reset the counter. I'm agree!

Plant 3D

• Would like the ability to keep equipment models between inventor and plant 3D dynamic.  I'm agree!
• Would like the ability to add spec and line number to equipment nozzles. I'm agree!
• When switching workspaces tool pallets, toolbars, ect…reset You need to save workspace with any name and is no't will be changed. WHEN SWITCHING BETWEEN 3D PIPING & P&ID WORKSPACES RESET.
• Larger library needed for control valve actuators. You can creat your own library in catalog editor. And if you don't like the form of existing actuators is posible to insert any 3D solid object as actuator. YES BUT THIS TAKES EXTRA TIME AND IS NOT OPTIMAL
• Would like the ability to rotate valve handwheels independently from valve. It's posible with blue arrows when the valve is selected. LIMITS THE RANGE OF RATATION ie..45 degrees
• When adding a nozzle to custom equipment the whole piece of equipment stays highlighted, minor but confusing. 
• PlantConnectJoint command does not work. It's work but is necessary have objects in the correct position, if you have slope pipes, is necessary to install Service Pack 1 for Plant3D. The correct position is that objects need to be perfectly allined, if the pipe or flange has any rotation in any axis and other object don't has the same rotation the objects don't will be jointed. IT DOES NOT WORK CORRECTLY. I HAVE MADE SURE TO 4 DECIMAL POINTS THAT THE 2 COMPONENTS WERE ALIGNED
• Would like the ability to place elbows/tees by center. Normally for to do this, I create the elbow or tee in the space of the model, and then move it with the AutoCAD command MOVE from center node. THAT IS A WORKAROUND NOT A FIX
• When accessing the pulldown for line numbers if you select turn all line numbers on to stay that way.
• When placing flow arrows or any other iso annotations they should be on the same layer as the selected line so that when isolating a line you do not have all of the floating iso annotations. I'm agree!
• I have found that the dimension of 3000lb 90 ell and tee are different. Industry standard says this should be the same. This does not instill confidence in the rest of the dimensions being correct and I do not have the time to check all these dimensions. I'm agree! I usually revise all dimensions before start the project.

[thebearjed]

Isometrics

• Would like spool tags to be larger and/or double lined to stand out more, or have the ability to edit the spool tags in project manager. Spool tags are AutoCAD blocks which is modificable from Project Setup. TRIED THIS. NEVER WORKS RIGHT
• When placing an edit location you cannot edit it to say anything?
• Force iso onto one sheet does not work. It's work, in the cases when is not work you need to revise the pipe, because it will be disconnect in any point. Hovever I had in one project this proble with only one pipe which were connected and the force iso didn't working, the solution were use the QUICKISO and selected manually all pipe.THIS 100% DOES NOT WORK. 
• If investing in the program long term there will be a need for a stand alone iso program.
• Spool not produced because if iso message. Erase iso message in model and iso is produced?
• Spool Ansi B does not dimension location of olets.  You can create your own type of representation for isos in project setup and configure all this things. PROGRAM SHOULD DIMENSION THIS
• Would like the ability to rename isos in project manager. Changing TAG of Line group in Project Manager. Or more simply "Save as .." And save it to another folder. WORKAROUND NOT A FIX
• Flex hose and flow meter placed as custom objects does not get called on BOM. Revise propertie LongDescription Size of the objects. TRIED IT BEFORE. DOSENT WORK
• Would like the ability to suppress dimensions on vents and drains. This I not necessary and clouds up the iso. In the Project setup go to the title setup, and than it will be changed in the themes styles (I don't remember exactly the name of the bottom)
• Greater level of control desired for iso program in general. See isogen. 

Orthos  Is posible to configure all this things manually but I think that Autodesk need to do better the ortho interface generally, because now it don't have nothing default.

• Need better interface for annotating orthos.
• Need the ability to annotate centerline and bottom of pipe elevations.
• Need the ability to annotate instrumentation

[Vitornis]

Spool Ansi B does not dimension location of olets. You can create your own type of representation for isos in project setup and configure all this things. PROGRAM SHOULD DIMENSION THIS Im using Plant3D 2013 and I can't get it to dimension Olets on spool drawings.

[PeterQuinn]

I have some comments on some of your issues.

Larger library needed for control valve actuators.

Yes, this is something we're looking to do at some point in the future*. You're not the only one who wants this.

Would like the ability to rotate valve handwheels independently from valve.
Yes. Agreed. It's something that we are considering.

Would like the ability to place elbows/tees by center.
There's a way to do this. Try using the control key while moving the tee or elbow.

Force iso onto one sheet does not work.
This works correctly in 2014 Extension 2.

Spool Ansi B does not dimension location of olets.
The idea of the various isometrics styles is to provide you a starting point. We expect that everyone will customize the isometric styles to their own needs. You can change this. I accept the argument that the defaults should be better.

Would like the ability to suppress dimensions on vents and drains
You can do this. I don't know what you have to set to do so. Perhaps someone else knows on this forum. If you don't get an answer promptly, post a separate question and I'll get someone to investigate.

Greater level of control desired for iso program in general. See isogen.
You have the ability to customize so much. The problem is that it's hard to find what to change and how to change it. If there is something specific that you want to know, create a post here and I'll make sure you get an answer. I agree that this is too hard and it's something we're working on in the future.

*I'm not allowed to give specifics in a public forum

[thebearjed]

i realize that some of these issues have been resolved and some have not. this post started back in 01-30-2012 after all.