AutoCAD P&ID General Discussion

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Contributor
ronjanssen30
Posts: 21
Registered: ‎01-26-2010
Message 1 of 9 (736 Views)

instrument valves

736 Views, 8 Replies
02-24-2010 01:54 AM
In our PID's we use instrument balloons which are usually connected with leaders to the drawing. Sometimes however, an instrument valve is placed ahead of that balloon.(Check attached picture) This valve can not be placed in a leader, therefore a signal line must be placed.

The problem is that this signal line can not have acquistion rules with other pipelines, thus making it impossible to link the process condtions to the valve and instrument.

I have tried to make an instrument valve as a type of instrumentation and then have two "instruments" on each other connected to the pipeline, but that does not work either.

I could make several new pipe line groups for these lines, but I do not wish to see them in the database and line lists.

At the moment I am quite lost so I hope someone else has a solution for this problem. Edited by: ronjanssen30 on Feb 24, 2010 9:55 AM
Contributor
ronjanssen30
Posts: 21
Registered: ‎01-26-2010
Message 2 of 9 (735 Views)

Re: instrument valves

02-24-2010 05:18 AM in reply to: ronjanssen30
I now have added a new valve to the symbols which looks like the instrument valve and the piece of pipeline bound together. The idea was to retrieve the process data from the valve. However, for some reason, instruments cannot retrieve data from valves. WHY???

I really hope that Autodesk can solve this quickly, or give me a solution to my problem.
Contributor
ronjanssen30
Posts: 21
Registered: ‎01-26-2010
Message 3 of 9 (735 Views)

Re: instrument valves

02-24-2010 06:44 AM in reply to: ronjanssen30
If I make a new inline instrument symbol which looks like a line with a valve within as described in my previous post, I can insert it into a line and then make an Annotation look like my balloons. The problem with this is that the valve will not have his own unique KKS code.

Please help me
Valued Contributor
mel_mason
Posts: 57
Registered: ‎01-04-2010
Message 4 of 9 (735 Views)

Re: instrument valves

02-24-2010 01:53 PM in reply to: ronjanssen30
I am having some difficultly in understanding exactly what you are trying to do.
From what i am getting is that you have an instrument or control valve that also has an instrument bubble that is assocaited with the valve as in my picture that I have attached?
Contributor
ronjanssen30
Posts: 21
Registered: ‎01-26-2010
Message 5 of 9 (735 Views)

Re: instrument valves

02-25-2010 12:08 AM in reply to: ronjanssen30
The baseline of my problem is that I want an instrument valve between a pipe line and an instrument and I want both the instrument and the valve to withdraw properties from the pipeline (see picture). A valve can not be placed in a leader, therefore I have to place an actual line segment. But I do not want this linesegment to be visible in my database among my other lines.
For that I could use a signal line which is not visible among the solid pipe lines. The problem with this line is that it cannot connect with the main pipeline, thus unable to pass the properties from that line to the instrument and the valve.

Last thing I have done (see attached picture) is to create a new instrument which looks like the symbol on the left and then annotated that symbol with the instrument bubble we normally use. This results in the symbol on the right.
The problem with this is that I can only autonumber the instrument, but the valve is a part of the instrument and thus not an individual part of the database.
Alumni
EileenForan
Posts: 138
Registered: ‎08-15-2007
Message 6 of 9 (735 Views)

Re: instrument valves

02-26-2010 11:11 AM in reply to: ronjanssen30
Hi:

I asked our developer (Lynn) to take a look at the issue you mention. Here is her response. Please comment on whether this helps with your issue:

----

“The problem is that this signal line can not have acquistion rules with other pipelines, thus making it impossible to link the process condtions to the valve and instrument.”

This statement is not correct:

In fact, there is a way to accomplish this.

Associate the Signal Line Group to Pipe Line Group:

1. Right click the signal line, “Edit Sline Group”
2. Subcommand “Associate”
3. Select the pipeline.

For the property in question, set up acquisition like this, where the arrow means “acquires from”:

SignalLine -> SignalLineGroup
SignalLineGroup -> PipeLineGroup
Assets on either kind of line -> Lines (so that they can acquire the property whether they are inline to either the pipeline or signal line).


Eileen Foran
Community Program Manager
Autodesk Plant Solutions
Autodesk, Inc.

.
Contributor
ronjanssen30
Posts: 21
Registered: ‎01-26-2010
Message 7 of 9 (735 Views)

Re: instrument valves

03-01-2010 12:43 AM in reply to: ronjanssen30
It works!

I have to say though that it does not win the beauty price the way it has to be arranged. Because now I have to acquire about 20 properties from the pipe lines, to their groups, to the signal line group and finally to the signal lines.

Thanks a lot for helping me out, but I hope this can be fixed in the next version.
New Member
goin06
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎10-08-2013
Message 8 of 9 (353 Views)

Re: instrument valves

10-08-2013 05:02 AM in reply to: ronjanssen30

Yes.  It is connected but I need to update in data manager for each item like service, spec (i.e. for each item I have to click "overide" and then "aquisition")

 

I want to confirm whether the above is the procedure or there is some shortcut.

 

Govindaraj

Mentor
craig.wood
Posts: 215
Registered: ‎02-20-2012
Message 9 of 9 (337 Views)

Re: instrument valves

10-09-2013 08:56 AM in reply to: ronjanssen30

Ron,

 

Check out this thread - it has a few different solutions you can try to accomplish your goal.

 

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/AutoCAD-P-ID/Tag-Acquisition/td-p/3223978

 

Craig

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