What is the advantage of having mechanical over autocad?

[not2013]

I am not sure when mechanical desktop (as it was 1st call or labeled) came out, so I do not know why autodesk came out with it, and what there reasoning was.  Surely there was a reason for it's creation.  But If I already have a 3D software why would I need mech? 

[Bob_Zurunkle]

I am no expert in Mechanical, but we use it for its files of beams, channels and L-shapes. It also creates a lot of fastener assemblies, counterbores etc. It looks to me like it also creates quick view layouts for orthographic projection, sections, auxhilliary views etc. It is built on the AutoCAD platform as a vertical product (as is AutoCAD Architecture), so it facilitates the creation of these assemblies and their drawing layouts faster and more directly than trying to do it with AutoCAD. You also have the option of starting up plain ol' AutoCAD through the Start menu.

Bear in mind I think this predates Inventor for machine design, but it seems to straddle the worlds of machine and structure.

[dgorsman]

It includes a number of mechanical-related design tools which are not in the OOTB vanilla AutoCAD product.  This makes it suitable for users who do lightweight mechanical design where they don't need the features found in more complex products such as Inventor or competitors.

Mechanical can also play host to a number of third-party plug-ins for doing discipline specific work that simply cannot be done in Inventor, such as electrical schematics, process flow diagrams, and so on.  Sometimes its necessary to use such products to meets client requirements, such as ProStructures for structural design, which won't load into Inventor.  And sometimes you get legacy DWG content which needs updating.

[JDMather]

Are you aware that Mechanical Desktop and AutoCAD Mechanical are two completely different programs (other than that they are both built on top of AutoCAD)?

Are you aware that AutoCAD Mechanical and Mechanical Desktop were once both available (I don't understand your, "as it was 1st called?."  They were always two different programs.

Are you aware that this is the AutoCAD Mechanical forum and that the Mechanical Desktop forum is over here

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/Autodesk-Mechanical-Desktop/bd-p/89

Are you aware that in Feb 2002 Autodesk stopped selling Mechanical Desktop and gave it away for free with Autodesk Inventor until Mechanical Desktop was discontinued in 2009?

Is your question really about the advantage of AutoCAD Mechanical (an existing program) or is it really about the discontinued Mechanical Desktop?

What 3D CAD program are you trying to compare?

[not2013]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Are you aware that Mechanical Desktop and AutoCAD Mechanical are two completely different programs (other than that they are both built on top of AutoCAD)?

No I am not, and I do not believe that they are completely different.  I believe that they are very simular, except I bet osnaps worked in mechanical dtop and they are unstable in mechanical. I believe that autocad and Ms excel are to completely different softwares.

Are you aware that AutoCAD Mechanical and Mechanical Desktop were once both available (I don't understand your, "as it was 1st called?."  They were always two different programs.

No, thx for the info.  Does autodesk tell us any of this in mechanical? I do not think so, so how would I know these things?   Thats why I'm asking.

Are you aware that this is the AutoCAD Mechanical forum and that the Mechanical Desktop forum is over here

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/Autodesk-Mechanical-Desktop/bd-p/89

Yes

Are you aware that in Feb 2002 Autodesk stopped selling Mechanical Desktop and gave it away for free with Autodesk Inventor until Mechanical Desktop was discontinued in 2009?

No

Is your question really about the advantage of AutoCAD Mechanical (an existing program) or is it really about the discontinued Mechanical Desktop?

If you read my subject I am sure you are intelligent enough to figure that out on your own.

What 3D CAD program are you trying to compare?

Any 3D CAD software that actually works, why would I need mechanical instead of autocad?

Simply trying to ascertain why this product exist, or if I ever need to use it. I see no need in learning a new software when autocad works fine.  According to autodesk (whom are not always honest or correct) mechical is for manufacturing.  Well i'm in design engineering not manufacturering.  Interesting enough the guys in manufactureing prefer to use autocad and none have mechanical. I do not think we need it here at all, and I want to write an explaination of how mechancial waste time and hurts productivity so we can get it removed from our computers. Before I do this I need to know if there is a real reason for mechanical I see none to date.  

Thx for your info and have a nice day!

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[steve216586]

I can provide several reasons Mechanical is more useful to a Design Engineer than vanilla:

1. Creation of mechanical assemblies.

Each part of an assembly can be created separately in individual drawing files. Thus, a complicated assembly can be distributed, by part, to a team of designers. Once the parts have been completed, any user can assemble all or a part of the assembly from the library of parts.

2. BOM

Each part contains BOM information such as material, quantity required, weight, etc. The BOM is a customizable feature.

3. Isometric views

Each part may provide all the isometric views required to fabricate the part. Each of these "child" views are "parented" to the part. Every time a view or part is modified, every other view of that part in the assembly is updated with the modification. Similar to a block in vanilla AutoCAD but much "smarter".

4. Custom Structures.

If a user has a block or drawing of an object, you can create a custom structure from it. The user can then associate BOM data to it for repetetive useage. They will also update modifications to the original structure and views for subsequent drawings as long as the link between the copy and the source has not been intentionally broken by the user.

5. Linetype properties can be designated for objects and certain types of line useage. e.g. Office standards can be more easily controlled if your customization is set up to your preferences. e.g. Red, CenterX2, 0.15 is designated for all centerlines.

6. Custom titleblock creation and useage.

Vanilla AutoCAD doesn't support this feature.

I'm sure there are more features which differentiate Mechanical from vanilla. Thre are numerous tools which enhance your workflow.

Not to be cruel, but you sound like the guy who didn't want to switch from his horse and carriage, to an auto, because he missed talking to the horses.

[dgorsman]

Building a business case only on badmouthing the software or ignoring advantages for cases you don't like won't go over well, especially if there is a lack of experience on the part of the presenter.  You will need to show what AutoCAD can do that Mechanical cannot, which is nothing, which isn't a valid business case.  Add to that the additional costs of uninstalling, changing licensing, re-installing.  You will need to show what Mechanical can do which vanilla AutoCAD cannot (regardless of your personal feelings), which is many things; this requires the presenter to have some ability with the software, whether self-taught or through a third party.

[steve216586]

For what it worth. I've used Mechanical for the past two jobs I've had (9 yrs). I used it for manufacturing, civil, and mechanical processes.

I also forgot the invaluable tool of the AMSHIDE. Oh, where would I be without that feature? Could you imagine exploding blocks to trim parts obscured by another part in an assembly. Then only to have the fabrication guys tell you they had to move that part because they had an "on the spot" change. Now you have to go back and rebuild all the parts you trimmed and move the part in the foreground, then retrim all the obscured parts again. Waste of up to two or three hours if you have three views to update.

Trust me, I've fought to get Mechanical at my current job for that reason alone. Before that, everyone line and block drew... tediously!

[JDMather]

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not2013 wrote:

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Any 3D CAD software that actually works, why would I need mechanical instead of autocad?

  Well i'm in design engineering not manufacturering.  ... 

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I don't think the majority of users in the manufacturing or design engineering field consider either AutoCAD or AutoCAD Mechanical to be true 3D CAD programs.  They would describe these programs as 2D CAD programs with some 3D capabilities.
I recommend you take a look at a modern 3D CAD program built for this purpose (design and manufacturing) like Autodesk Inventor.  Keep in mind that any type of realistic comparison requires extensive training and experience.  These are professional programs and deserve (require?) a professional level of preparation.

I recommend that you suggest that your supervisor/decision maker attend Autodesk University - a 3-day conference in early December where experts from around the world will be in attendance.  Many of these experts will have extensive experience with virtually every 3D CAD program available (not just Autodesk employees or products).

[not2013]

Okay so if your company is ignoring reality then you have to makes changes at the end of your design that should have been incorporated from the start.  So if you company is not paying attention to reality then it makes sense to have mechanical over autocad.

I see your point.

[not2013]

Another person out of grasp with reality.  The question was if we have a 3D software already why do we need mechanical instead of autocad.

The answer is:       You do not need mech at all if you have a 3D software.

Some of these things you listed I was doing with Autocad in the 90's.  So again you are out of grasp with reality or deliberately posting deceitful statements if they are facts.

I have never owned a horse or carriage, but considering some of the replys I get to simple question it is like I am dealing with some whom have the intellect just above a horse. 

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Not to be cruel, but you sound like the guy who didn't want to switch from his horse and carriage, to an auto, because he missed talking to the horses.

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Not to be cruel then you make a statement that some would see as cruel or a dis.  This is an example if double speak.   Which is a sign of an unstable mind. Please watch the movie 1984 to see what type of mind needs to use double speak.

Have a nice day!

[not2013]

Yes thx for reply.  I see that mech has more options than autocad (I have never doubted that), but again we already have 3D software.  We really do not need mech if we have a 3D modeling software.  This is what I'm trying to ascertain.

I am sure that I could continue to create drawings that are used to create parts like I've been doing for over 20 years with solidworks & autocad.  Which would be a fraction of the price of getting the mech/inventor suite.

Now if we didn't have a 3D software then it might make sense to have mechanical over autocad expect for the fact that mechanical is unstable.   I do not like unstable software and I'm not sure what type of mind does like unstable software.

I am not badmouthing just telling the truth.   Big difference. 

Thank you though, these replys have convinced me that mechanical is total un-nessecary for our needs.   

Have a great day!

[not2013]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@not2013 wrote:

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Any 3D CAD software that actually works, why would I need mechanical instead of autocad?

  Well i'm in design engineering not manufacturering.  ... 

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I don't think the majority of users in the manufacturing or design engineering field consider either AutoCAD or AutoCAD Mechanical to be true 3D CAD programs.  They would describe these programs as 2D CAD programs with some 3D capabilities.
I recommend you take a look at a modern 3D CAD program built for this purpose (design and manufacturing) like Autodesk Inventor.  Keep in mind that any type of realistic comparison requires extensive training and experience.  These are professional programs and deserve (require?) a professional level of preparation.

I recommend that you suggest that your supervisor/decision maker attend Autodesk University - a 3-day conference in early December where experts from around the world will be in attendance.  Many of these experts will have extensive experience with virtually every 3D CAD program available (not just Autodesk employees or products).

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Oh boy another out of grasp reply.    I know that neither Acad or mech are 3D softwares.

The question again if we already have a 3D software then why do we need mechanical?

I have the following 3D softwares installed on my work PC..

Catia  V5R20

Creo 5.0

Pro-E Wildfire 4.0

Unigraphics 7.5

Inventor 2013

Solidworks 2010 on my home PC.  I also was trained in the early 80's on Computervision.  Many of your here may not hav even heard of Computervision.  Was making $75 an hour detailing drawings on Computervision in the early 80's for Caterpilla.  Now people make 10-15 an hour to detial prints. I don't feel I need anyone to tell me about 3D softwares.

Answer is WE DO NOT need mechanical.  It's unnecessary!

As for autodesk University why would we pay to listen to people whom are paid by autodesk tell us that autodesk products are the best.  Autodesk doesn't even stand behind it's products. People whom purchased the  autodesk help service cannot get autodesk to even answer all of there questions.

Attended my 1st Autodesk University in 1996 and it was an enjoyable time, but that was then and the autodesk has changed in many different negative ways.

Good day!

[steve216586]

"I have the following 3D softwares installed on my work PC.."

Catia  V5R20

Creo 5.0

Pro-E Wildfire 4.0

Unigraphics 7.5

Inventor 2013

"I also was trained in the early 80's on Computervision."

"Answer is WE DO NOT need mechanical.  It's unnecessary!"

Why is someone so well versed in 3D software for close to 30 years asking a rhetorical question about a 2D software? You should be the SME on CAD software! Most of us should be paying you to tell us what software to use for our individual purposes. Did you only start this thread to get others to vindicate your stance and opinion of AutoCAD Mechanical so you could show these replies to your superiors? I only say that because when you didn't get that, you seemed to get very angry. That, and you already knew the answer you wanted to hear...

 You told us so! Many times!

C'mon man! be a problem solver, not a problem maker. Make a choice and use ONE! If you don't like the choice your superiors have made, we're certainly not going to change their minds. If that choice bothers you so much, just walk away.

My company has AutoCAD (Vanilla, Mechanical, Electical), Inventor, Alibre, Pro-E, Bentley (MicroStation, PlantWise), SolidEdge. I learned AutoCAD (Vanilla, Architectural, Land Desktop) MicroStation and Pro-E through my college. I learned Alibre, Inventor and SolidEdge OJT. I use AutoCAD Mechanical and Vanilla daily. I rarely use Alibre. I never use the others any more. Why? Because it takes at least an hour to get into the efficiency range desired to be competent switching from Vanilla to MicroStation, let alone to Pro-E.

I've been drafting since '83. On the Board until 2001. I would never think of asking anyone how to "Draft" with that much experience. I know Scaling, how layouts should appear, where dimensions should go, etc. I do ask about software commands now and then for those seldom used. I don't degrade any software to peers let alone those the "higher-ups" want to utilize. They all have their purposes. If asked to switch softwares, I would switch softwares. I wouldn't make a public announcement just to degrade a software I wasn't comfortable with or didn't think it served my purposes. (Especially with almost 30 years experience and hopefully being mature enough to bite my tongue on the forum of the company I was degrading.) I worked many "free" overtime hours to learn Alibre at my current job because I was asked to do so, even though I may not use it on a daily basis. That is why I am "valuable" and not a pain in someone's side who's making the corporate decisions. Or else, one day that decision could be to let me go.

[not2013]

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@steve216586 wrote:

"I have the following 3D softwares installed on my work PC.."

Catia  V5R20

Creo 5.0

Pro-E Wildfire 4.0

Unigraphics 7.5

Inventor 2013

"I also was trained in the early 80's on Computervision."

"Answer is WE DO NOT need mechanical.  It's unnecessary!"

Why is someone so well versed in 3D software for close to 30 years asking a rhetorical question about a 2D software?

What rhetorical question is that? Could you please put it in quotes so I understand exactly what question you are refering too.  thx

You should be the SME on CAD software! Most of us should be paying you to tell us what software to use for our individual purposes.

I do not offer that service sorry.

Did you only start this thread to get others to vindicate your stance and opinion of AutoCAD Mechanical so you could show these replies to your superiors?

No to find out if I really need mechanical or not.   That is why I started this thread.  It is very simple sir.

I only say that because when you didn't get that, you seemed to get very angry. That, and you already knew the answer you wanted to hear...

Not angry, frustrated that when I ask a simple question I many times cannot get a straight answer.  That usually means that someone is hiding something or not competent enough to answer in the 1st place.

 You told us so! Many times!

I told you what so many times?  Please put in quotes.  Also how many times, and on what dates did I say this?

C'mon man! be a problem solver, not a problem maker.

I didn't write the software.  I did not create the problems.  If it worked okay I would never come here.  The software behaves different on  different days or if I have certain other softwares open or running.  Thats the problem in most cases.

Make a choice and use ONE! If you don't like the choice your superiors have made, we're certainly not going to change their minds. If that choice bothers you so much, just walk away.

Well in a way you folks already have, thx.

My company has AutoCAD (Vanilla, Mechanical, Electical), Inventor, Alibre, Pro-E, Bentley (MicroStation, PlantWise), SolidEdge. I learned AutoCAD (Vanilla, Architectural, Land Desktop) MicroStation and Pro-E through my college. I learned Alibre, Inventor and SolidEdge OJT. I use AutoCAD Mechanical and Vanilla daily. I rarely use Alibre. I never use the others any more. Why? Because it takes at least an hour to get into the efficiency range desired to be competent switching from Vanilla to MicroStation, let alone to Pro-E.

Yes I agree why waste time!

I've been drafting since '83. On the Board until 2001. I would never think of asking anyone how to "Draft" with that much experience. I know Scaling, how layouts should appear, where dimensions should go, etc. I do ask about software commands now and then for those seldom used. I don't degrade any software to peers let alone those the "higher-ups" want to utilize.

higher-ups - Were all created equal my friend. There is no such thing as a higher up. 

They all have their purposes. If asked to switch softwares, I would switch softwares. I wouldn't make a public announcement just to degrade a software I wasn't comfortable with or didn't think it served my purposes. (Especially with almost 30 years experience and hopefully being mature enough to bite my tongue on the forum of the company I was degrading.) 

You would lay down for the corporation, well that is where we disagree.   I was born in the USA and were not suppose to lay down.

I worked many "free" overtime hours to learn Alibre at my current job because I was asked to do so, even though I may not use it on a daily basis.

That is a desperate decision you made.  I would never do that.  I would help out someone I didn't know if they needed it, but would not become a slave to a company. By the way you should read the Emancipation Proclamation. It effectively outlawed slavery in the USA.

That is why I am "valuable" and not a pain in someone's side who's making the corporate decisions. Or else, one day that decision could be to let me go.

I'm only a pain to those who are hiding the truth.

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Only the truth can set you FREE!

[steve216586]

The truth: http://images.autodesk.com/adsk/files/ACADM07_Detail.pdf I know this is dated but it says more than what you have been told so far adn is still applicable.

[not2013]

And Jerry Mathers as the Beaver!   from Leave it to Beaver

Yes, well if the software was stable but myself and others have found that not to be.

And if autodesk wasn't fraudulent in it's advertising of it's products.  I would be able to accept this as the truth, but I have absolute evidence of fraud by autodesk.

Without a sworn affidavit I am assuming these are just more lies from autowreck I mean autodesk.

There is no need for mech since I have stable 3D softwares to use.  

I already know AUTOCAD   not going to waste my time learning something that will change next year and again the following year and again and again and again.   Autocad will work fine forever. Buy it once and use it forever.

Vanilla taste better than doody on any given day!