AutoCAD Map 3D

[#1]

Hi all!

I have a problem with "Polygon and Oracle extension".
I have several thousands (30 000+) of lines and arcs imported from an
old Finnish GIS application called FinGIS. Those lines and arcs define
4200+ areas. Some areas are inside the others.
FinGIS' data was divided into 1sqkm files and it had to cut the lines on
the file borders and calculate new endpoints for the resulting lines.
Sometimes this resulted as a small (1mm) gaps between the lines. So with
AutoCAD I have to do some "drawing cleanup". First "snap clustered
nodes" with 0.005 tolerance, then "break crossing objects" and "delete
duplicate objects". Finally I am able to create a polygon topology
without any errors.
Now I use "Polygon and Oracle extensions" "convert topology to polygons"
-function to create Oracle-type polygons on a new layer. Everything
seems to work fine and I get the areas I wanted with the islands correct
and all.
Now the problem occurs when I try to write these to Oracle. Over 4000 of
these areas are exported just fine but 140 of them cannot be exported.
The error message says something like "AutoCAD cannot export unbalanced
mpolygons to Oracle". Is there any "official" explanation on what does
this "unbalanced mpolygon" actually mean?
With a help from our Finnish reseller/distributor Viasys we've noticed
that the problem areas all have arcs on them. According to Viasys
AutoCAD has generated the new areas so that the arc and the line
actually create a new really really small area, meaning that the line
and the arc actually cross each other again, even though I managed to
create a topology without any errors!
So where is the real problem, in topology creation or in polygon
creation or in both, and what do I do to get rid of it?
I really hope you understand what I mean.
At first the new "Polygon and Oracle extension" looked really good. It
was exactly what I wanted. However this problem means that I have no use
for it after all.

Thanks,
j.

--
Jarkko Aaltonen
City Survey Department
City Of Tampere
Finland

[#2]

Hi Jarkko,

I believe the answers to most of your questions can
be found in the Polygon and Advanced Oracle Extension Help (the question mark on
the Extension tool bar).  You asked "what does unbalanced Mpolygon
actually mean?", from the Help file:

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">
face=Arial size=2>Balancing - Process where the polygon object recalculates
which boundaries are outer or inner. Boundaries are designated as inner or outer
when the polygon is created and when new boundaries are added to the
object.

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">
face=Arial size=2> 

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">
face=Arial size=2>You can edit the polygon object to rebalance it and then you
should be able to export to Oracle.  Please see Mpolygon>Rebalancing in
the Autodesk Map Polygon and Advanced Oracle extension Help.

 
Regards,

Andrea Bell
GIS Product Support
Technician

"Jarkko Aaltonen" <
href="mailto:jarkko.aaltonen@tt.tampere.fi">
size=2>jarkko.aaltonen@tt.tampere.fi>
wrote in message
face=Arial size=2>news:3CF61AB8.3010707@tt.tampere.fi
size=2>...

> Hi all!
>
> I
have a problem with "Polygon and Oracle extension".
> I have several
thousands (30 000+) of lines and arcs imported from an
> old Finnish GIS
application called FinGIS. Those lines and arcs define
> 4200+ areas.
Some areas are inside the others.
> FinGIS' data was divided into 1sqkm
files and it had to cut the lines on
> the file borders and calculate new
endpoints for the resulting lines.
> Sometimes this resulted as a small
(1mm) gaps between the lines. So with
> AutoCAD I have to do some
"drawing cleanup". First "snap clustered
> nodes" with 0.005 tolerance,
then "break crossing objects" and "delete
> duplicate objects". Finally I
am able to create a polygon topology
> without any errors.
> Now I
use "Polygon and Oracle extensions" "convert topology to polygons"
>
-function to create Oracle-type polygons on a new layer. Everything
>
seems to work fine and I get the areas I wanted with the islands correct

> and all.
> Now the problem occurs when I try to write these to
Oracle. Over 4000 of
> these areas are exported just fine but 140 of them
cannot be exported.
> The error message says something like "AutoCAD
cannot export unbalanced
> mpolygons to Oracle". Is there any "official"
explanation on what does
> this "unbalanced mpolygon" actually
mean?
> With a help from our Finnish reseller/distributor Viasys we've
noticed
> that the problem areas all have arcs on them. According to
Viasys
> AutoCAD has generated the new areas so that the arc and the line

> actually create a new really really small area, meaning that the line

> and the arc actually cross each other again, even though I managed to

> create a topology without any errors!
> So where is the real
problem, in topology creation or in polygon
> creation or in both, and
what do I do to get rid of it?
> I really hope you understand what I
mean.
> At first the new "Polygon and Oracle extension" looked really
good. It
> was exactly what I wanted. However this problem means that I
have no use
> for it after all.
>
> Thanks,
>
j.
>
> --
> Jarkko Aaltonen
> City Survey
Department
> City Of Tampere
> Finland
>

[#3]

Andrea Bell wrote:
> Hi Jarkko,
>
> I believe the answers to most of your questions can be found in the
> Polygon and Advanced Oracle Extension Help (the question mark on the
> Extension tool bar). You asked "what does unbalanced Mpolygon actually
> mean?", from the Help file:
> /Balancing - Process where the polygon object recalculates which
> boundaries are outer or inner. Boundaries are designated as inner or
> outer when the polygon is created and when new boundaries are added to
> the object./
>
> You can edit the polygon object to rebalance it and then you should be
> able to export to Oracle. Please see Mpolygon>Rebalancing in the Autodesk Map Polygon and Advanced Oracle extension Help.
>
> Regards,
> Andrea Bell
> GIS Product Support Technician
>

Hi!

Thank you for your reply. However, in this case rebalancing doesn't
help. I still can't export the objects to Oracle and I get the same
error message: "Cannot export an unbalanced MPolygon object. etc".
And even if I could export them it really wouldn't help much since the
original problem would still remain: Why does this happen? I've always
thought that if I am able to create a polygon topology I can also expect
that my data is correct and there are no crossing lines for example. But
after I create the mpolygons from that same topology my data is
suddenly incorrect. I ask again: why?

j.

[#4]

An addition to my previous post.
If I explode one of the unbalanced mpolygons to lines and arcs, then do
a drawing cleanup with "break crossing objects" -option I get this:

Modified object(s) :0
Deleted object(s) :0
Created object(s) :0

So, it tells me that there are no crossing objects, right?

After this I use "pedit" to create a new closed polyline from the lines
and arcs. When I try to create a new mpolygon from this polyline I get this:

One boundary was rejected because it crosses.

So there is a crossing after all. Why don't the drawing cleanup find it?
Why am I still able to create a polygon topology? Is there something
wrong in the accuracy of the drawing cleanup tool?

j.

[#5]

Hello Jarkko,

Can you please post your dwg to the customer files group? I would like to
take a look at this problem in more detail.
Thank you,
Mark Christian
GIS Product Support
Autodesk, Inc.
"Jarkko Aaltonen" wrote in message
news:3CF8C2FE.6090903@tt.tampere.fi...
> An addition to my previous post.
> If I explode one of the unbalanced mpolygons to lines and arcs, then do
> a drawing cleanup with "break crossing objects" -option I get this:
>
> Modified object(s) :0
> Deleted object(s) :0
> Created object(s) :0
>
> So, it tells me that there are no crossing objects, right?
>
> After this I use "pedit" to create a new closed polyline from the lines
> and arcs. When I try to create a new mpolygon from this polyline I get
this:
>
> One boundary was rejected because it crosses.
>
> So there is a crossing after all. Why don't the drawing cleanup find it?
> Why am I still able to create a polygon topology? Is there something
> wrong in the accuracy of the drawing cleanup tool?
>
> j.
>
>

[#6]

Mark Christian wrote:
> Hello Jarkko,
>
> Can you please post your dwg to the customer files group? I would like to
> take a look at this problem in more detail.
> Thank you,
> Mark Christian
> GIS Product Support
> Autodesk, Inc.

Hi!

It should be there now. The subject line is "Polygon and Oracle
extension problem sample"

Dwg includes only one area but you should be able to reproduce the
behaviour I described in my previous message.
Shortly:
- drawing cleanup does nothing
- pedit creates a closed polyline
- cannot create mpolygon because "the polyline crosses"

j.

[#7]

Thank you Jarko.

I'll take a look and give you an update ASAP.

Mark
"Jarkko Aaltonen" wrote in message
news:3CFC5C22.4060705@tt.tampere.fi...
> Mark Christian wrote:
> > Hello Jarkko,
> >
> > Can you please post your dwg to the customer files group? I would like
to
> > take a look at this problem in more detail.
> > Thank you,
> > Mark Christian
> > GIS Product Support
> > Autodesk, Inc.
>
> Hi!
>
> It should be there now. The subject line is "Polygon and Oracle
> extension problem sample"
>
> Dwg includes only one area but you should be able to reproduce the
> behaviour I described in my previous message.
> Shortly:
> - drawing cleanup does nothing
> - pedit creates a closed polyline
> - cannot create mpolygon because "the polyline crosses"
>
> j.
>

[#8]

Mark Christian wrote:
> Thank you Jarko.
>
> I'll take a look and give you an update ASAP.
>
> Mark

Hi!

It has now been several days since your last message.
My guess is that you were actually able to reproduce the behaviour I
described and that you have no idea what causes it or how to get rid of it.
I think it is safe to say that I found a bug in your software. A bug
that makes the whole "Polygon and Oracle extension" totally useless.
Please tell me that I am wrong.

j.

[#9]

almost ten years later, a can tell that your problem with unbalanced Mp are originated becaus of using arcs. try to replace 'em with lines, build your polygon and try to upload it to oracle... voilá!. Don´t know who to blame Mr.Map.. or Mr.Ora. regards