AutoCAD MEP General

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Active Member
UmitB
Posts: 10
Registered: ‎01-19-2011
Message 1 of 12 (2,049 Views)

AMEP 2013 Issue

2049 Views, 11 Replies
04-10-2012 09:09 AM

Hi,

One of my customer had AMEP 2012 version which they are working really good. The new version of AMEP was arrived yesterday and they want to try it. But you new with new version of AMEP  (2013) you can save your .dwg file as 2013 AutoCAD file. When they want to open with AMEP 2012 they could not. Because we know older version can not open new versions. Everything is ok. But they try to save as 2010 AutoCAD/AutoCAD LT their file from AMEP 2013, they see that when they try to open with AMEP 2012 their file, all fittings are seem as a rectangular because they are AECB Objects. We try to PROXYGRAPHIS (1) but then we notice that the object are not MEP objects.

When we worked with AMEP 2011 and 2012 versions, we did not have any problem like saving AMEP 2011 or AMEP 2012. We can use our ducts, fittings, etc as a MEP objects, both versions of AMEP. My question is could we work with AMEP 2013 and AMEP 2012 software together? Because we have a work to continue. Thanks for your help.

Umit B

Distinguished Contributor
Posts: 429
Registered: ‎11-12-2003
Message 2 of 12 (2,036 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-10-2012 07:01 PM in reply to: UmitB

I suspect this is because 2013 has a new dwg file format so won't be able to be saved back/opened with 2012/11.

 

2011/2012 shared the same dwg format so probably why you didn't strike this problem

Active Member
UmitB
Posts: 10
Registered: ‎01-19-2011
Message 3 of 12 (2,029 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-10-2012 11:55 PM in reply to: robincapperw

Hi Robin,

It is importat for them because they have too much license and some of them working with AMEP 2012, some of them AMEP 2013. Now they had a work which they have to delivery. We know in Revit we can not save older versions. But in AMEP we can save but can not work. If this happens I think they have to tell their customer or they can explain it you can not work or save older versions.

 

 

Distinguished Contributor
Posts: 429
Registered: ‎11-12-2003
Message 4 of 12 (2,008 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-11-2012 04:46 PM in reply to: UmitB

I haven't got the release MEP 2013 yet (waiting for Suite) but the save back thing is usually covered in the readme & help

Product Support
Posts: 517
Registered: ‎08-23-2006
Message 5 of 12 (1,957 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-17-2012 01:04 PM in reply to: robincapperw

<2013 IS A FILE FORMAT RELEASE> Robin is correct.

 

This is out there though the information needs to be spread around more.  Please do what you can to help spread the information.  Every 4th release historically has been a file format release and 2013 is no different.  We see questions and surprises when users save their files in 2013 and then save back to an earlier version.  Then proceed to open in an older release.  The older release can no longer edit the AEC objects as intelligent objects.  Users not familiar with past file format releases may be surprised.

 

2010 was a file format release.  So 2011 and 2012 were on the same 2010 file format.  2011 and 2012 are backwards compatible with 2010.  You can save and open between any of those 3 releases because they are on the same format.  2010, 2011, 2012  However, save a 2010 file to the 2007 file format version, and we get the same backwards compatibility issue as between 2013 and 2010 formats.

 

2013 is the 4th and start of a new file format.  Files saved in 2013, then saved back to an earlier format cannot be edited in the prior format.  They become proxy objects, and for the most part the graphics display the same.  To edit them, we can Export To AutoCAD and then edit them as Core AutoCAD objects in the earlier release.

 

My advice is always to finish older projects in older release on the older file format.   Start new projects on the new release and format.

 

HTH,

Joshua



Joshua Benoist, PE
Senior Support Specialist
Product Support
Autodesk, Inc.

Valued Mentor
Posts: 2,246
Registered: ‎11-18-2003
Message 6 of 12 (1,915 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-20-2012 08:03 AM in reply to: Joshua.Benoist

I have attempted to follow Joshua's advice in the past... but have not been able to prevent / protect users from opening files in the new release. The result is "Oh... now you have to update all the dwg files and xrefs.?

 

Instead my position now is... move everyone to the new release and remove the old software. First order of business the first day on the new release... 'open all your drawing files, xrefs first on ALL currently live jobs and save them up'.

 

One issue with this ... all projects stake holders, in particular outside members of the design team and other disciplines need to be informed of the new software... this can be an issue and can cause really upset design team members. New enablers will also need to be sent. (albeit, I understand most all autodesk enablers are now part of the software?)

 

I'd like to get thoughts from others on these approaches to implementing new software.

Product Support
Posts: 517
Registered: ‎08-23-2006
Message 7 of 12 (1,911 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-20-2012 08:32 AM in reply to: mdhutchinson

There is no right answer for every company, project or circumstance.  So take my advice with a grain of salt and consider what is best in your circumstance.

 

Hmm.  You almost open up a bigger can of worms by forcing users with old projects to migrate to the new software.  Now you must force sub-contractors and extended design team members to upgrade, or live with exploding objects to save backwards to be compatible.

 

Instead, you are bound to have a few users that have the "Oops" moment and accidentally save in the newer version.  That's where good education, and having a good backup file system forms a safety net.  Educate as many as possible, restore a file from backup when accidentally upgraded.  Keep old projects on old version, start new projects on new.  It limits damage to the least amount of people and project files.

 

The age of the project drawing files and how far a jump from old release to new release should be a factor in your consideration.  If the extended design team (sub-contractors)  are using a very old release (or even just a few releases back), they may have a lot of user training to do to get up to speed on the newer versions.  Then they may also need to upgrade their own hardware.  By forcing an extended design team to upgrade, you may be forcing them into costs that they are unwilling to incurr.  Then you have a mixed environment of dwg file versions worse than if you just keep the project on it's original version.  It may be a cost the extended design team did not account for....  All can be avoided with a great backup system, education and communication.

 

I'll end with how I began.  There is no right answer for every company, project or circumstance.  So take my advice with a grain of salt and consider what is best in your circumstance.  And by all means, if someone else out there has suggestions please feel free to share here.  These forums are great for documenting ideas and suggestions.

 

HTH,

Joshua



Joshua Benoist, PE
Senior Support Specialist
Product Support
Autodesk, Inc.

Active Member
Mikanikal
Posts: 6
Registered: ‎10-11-2010
Message 8 of 12 (1,856 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-25-2012 01:08 PM in reply to: UmitB

Joshua,

 

We understand that there is a file format change every three years and 2013 is the beginning of that new change. Along with drafting, we also develop some software for AutoCAD MEP so we have to work with the ARX/.NET API changes as well but we are thrown for a loop with the lack of support AutoCAD MEP 2013 has to downgrade a drawing to the 2010-2012 formats.

 

We have drawings that were drawn in 2011 and 2012 and using those versions, are set to Automatically SaveAs the AutoCAD 2007/LT 2007 Drawing format. This is because we have customers that still use 2009 to view our drawings. It seems that I must be missing something because it was perfectly fine for a 2012 drawing to save as a 2007 format and have 2009 at least show the MEP duct, fittings, and piping. Proxy objects or not, the objects where still there.

 

When we try to do the same thing with an AutoCAD 2013 drawing (just experimented with MEP pipe/fittings as of now and settings PROXYGRAPHICS=1), we get only about 25% of the objects shown properly as proxy objects, the rest are shown as proxy squares on the screen. How is it that Autodesk can't even make their newer 2013 models downgrade to display properly in the most recent previous version?

 

It makes it pointless to even create a 3D drawing when there is coordination between trades and you have to Export a 3D drawing to a previous version which explodes all the objects to AutoCAD primitive objects to send it out.

Product Support
Posts: 517
Registered: ‎08-23-2006
Message 9 of 12 (1,850 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-25-2012 01:37 PM in reply to: Mikanikal

Attach us some sample images comparing 2010 and 2013 FF, and a sample file.  Will help to see how 2013 FF change is different from 2010 FF change.  To our knowledge, this FF change should be no different from past.  With that said, every file format release affects different objects and different parts of the program.  In the 2010 FF change, using pipe as an example, the pipe object may not have changed much with the 2010 FF from 2009.  So 2009 was able to display them despite the FF in 2010.  With the 2013 FF change, they may have changed enough from the 2010 FF to be shown as rectangular proxy objects.  Give me some example files and I'll look into the differences.



Joshua Benoist, PE
Senior Support Specialist
Product Support
Autodesk, Inc.

Distinguished Contributor
Posts: 139
Registered: ‎11-07-2003
Message 10 of 12 (1,807 Views)

Re: AMEP 2013 Issue

04-28-2012 08:16 AM in reply to: UmitB

Hate to "Negative Nelly" but what are the benefits of this new file format? I know the rule is every 4 releases they change the format, but just look at some of the answers/replies at what is required to be done. All of the projects I have worked on to not permit time for these kinds of tasks to be performed let alone try to manage when you have offices in different parts of the world.

Seems like the new versions are based on 'eye candy' features that I could do without. I downloaded the trial and was really hoping for some nice improvents based on performance. There are topics related to ACAD MEP performance being way too slow, file sizes out of control. And did Autodesk listen, or even hear what some of us are dealing with....

Nope, we got the Universal Piping Connectors, Replace Fittings feature, Progressive Updating and Migration Tools instead. Sounds pretty good.. but honestly it is still sluggish and slow for the simplist tasks.  

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