CHSPACE - Are there Option Settings or System Variables?

[Anonymous]

Been working with the full version of 2008

Have gone to most recent, but LT version

Problem: CHSPACE command is sending objects from paper space to model space at a scale factor something OTHER than the scale factor that is correct for the scale the viewport is set to

Brand new drawing file

Viewport scale is set to 1"=20'

polyline is drawn 1" long in paper space

polyline is selected and sent to model space

polyline measures 19'-11.9808" in model space (it should measure 20' . . . exactly)

Here is what command line shows in AutoCAD LT 2011:

Command: _pline
Specify start point:
Current line-width is 0'-0.0000"
Specify next point or [Arc/Halfwidth/Length/Undo/Width]: 1"
Specify next point or [Arc/Close/Halfwidth/Length/Undo/Width]:
Command: Specify opposite corner:
Command:
Command:
Command: _chspace 1 found
1 object(s) changed from PAPER space to MODEL space.
Objects were scaled by a factor of 239.980801535877 to maintain visual
appearance.

Performed exact same procedure using full version of 2008 and command line shows this:

Command: _pline
Specify start point:
Current line-width is 0'-0.0000"
Specify next point or [Arc/Halfwidth/Length/Undo/Width]: 1"
Specify next point or [Arc/Close/Halfwidth/Length/Undo/Width]:
Command: Specify opposite corner:
Command:
Command:
Command: _chspace 1 found
1 object(s) changed from PAPER space to MODEL space.
Objects were scaled by a factor of 240 to maintain visual
appearance.

Object properties shows length of polyline to be 20' as it should

I can set the viewport to the scale I need in the full version of 2008, save and close the drawing then open it in 2011 LT and when objects are moved from paper space to model space, the factor scale is now correct for the scale the viewport is set to

Can anyone tell me why the CHSPACE command in 2011 LT is not using the correct factor scale?

Is there a system variable, command line variable or option setting that can correct this?

Seems retarded to set the viewport scale in the full version of 2008 to get the CHSPACE command to work correctly in 2011 LT, but that will be my work around until someone can tell me how to get the CHSPACE command to work correctly from start to finish in 2011 LT

[hwalker]

It's a problem with LT I'll explain

If you use the scroll bars at the bottom of the screen to pan in your viewport. It changes the scale ever so slightly.

So even thought when you select the viewport it might say scale 1:1 it's actual scale could be 1:0.9999999999999999

Just manually change your viewport scale back to what you want it to be, before you use chspace. Yes I know it's a pain, but it's a workaround until Autodesk pull their finger out of their butt and fix it.

[Charles_Shade]

...and turn off the scrollbars perhaps?

[Anonymous]

Thank you SO much for your reply - good to know it's an upgrade glitch; was beginning to question the methods we used to change the viewport scale in the full version of 2008 as maybe not being "valid" or "correct" drafting practice with AutoCAD - I still have an educational version of AutoCAD 2006 on my laptop and will see what viewport scale changing methods will and won't work for that version as well

in AutoCAD LT 2011 I found that setting the initial viewport scale while using the Wizard to Create Layout will correct the viewport scale problem - objects will keep their exact proportinal length when moved from paper space to model space and vice versa; I have all my scroll bars on

Unfortunately if you change the viewport scale accessing properties or manually entering the viewport scale in the Viewport Scale Control the problem returns

I asked someone who has the FULL version of AutoCAD 2011 and guess what .  .  .  the viewport scaling problem is in that version also

Same work around applies in the full vesion of AutoCAD 2011 - the correct viewport scale can be set using the wizard to create a layout but changing the viewport scale after that (using either properties or the viewport scale control) causes the problem to return

When you say set the viewport scale manually are you using the viewport scale control and choosing from the dropdown menu or are you actually typing in the scale - in the full version of 2008 we literally could type in 1"=20' to set the viewport scale for one inch equals twenty feet; accessing properties limits us to what appears in the dropdown list (which we could edit using FORMAT . . Scale List)

Haven't tried to create multiple viewports using the wizard to see if the workaround viewport scaling "fix" works there too

Will see what affect presence and absence of scroll bars will have in future tests and post results here

Will also manually set the viewport scale just before using the CHSPACE command (we probably did things in the drawing between setting the viewport scale and using the CHSPACE command)

Again . . . thanks a bunch for posting your reply and letting me know I wasn't just me and that it's an upgrade glitch

[pendean]

I must admit I'm not a heavy user of CHSPACE, but I've not seen this issue else where so maybe the terms you use are not familiar to me.

"Unfortunately if you change the viewport scale accessing properties or manually entering the viewport scale in the Viewport Scale Control the problem returns"

accessing properties? Isn't that the same scalelist you get to everywhere else?

manually entering where?

Do you need to add to your scale list to be default all the time to fix the problem?

[Anonymous]

Scale list that would appear in the properties sidebar (see attached on how to access properties sidebar) IS the same one that appears everywhere else

You can manually enter the viewport scale in the window where you access the scale list (see attached)

We deal with drawings from other engineering and consultant firms

You may need to modify a drawing using a viewport scale that is NOT already in the scale list that comes in as part of the drawing

To edit the scale list requires accessing 5 separate dialogue windows to add a scale - this takes time we cannot afford

Manual entry in the viewport scale control in the viewport tool bar accomplishing setting the viewport scale in one step

I'ved used this method in the full versions of 2005 and 2008 with the scroll bars visible/in use and have never had scaling issues when sending objects back and forth between model space and paper space

[pendean]

I see now, you are in classic view, that explains a lot of what you were describing.

Without the need to enter custom scales all the time (Imperial, Architectural, there aren't too many above the core product provisions), we do the same thing with scroll bars (and enter scales inside viewports using ZOOM command's XP option, old school) and have never seen this issue. Perhaps your larger scale drawings have something to do with it that I cannot readily test here. UCS and PLAN are set to World in all of our files.

How many scales are there in your industry that you cannot afford 5-10minutes one morning or afternoon to enter the standard units into the scale list editor? Just curious since your examples so far don't seem to drift from the norm with Engineering departments.

[Anonymous]

Hmmm . . . maybe I'm missing something

When we add a new scale to the scale list the scale list change only becomes part of that drawing not a permanent addition to the program itself

If we work on someone elses drawing and need a scale that doesn't appear on the scale list for that drawing and we add one, that new scale isn't listed in the next drawing we open that might be from a different client

We create technical drawings and area maps and unfortunately our clients and in-house staff don't base their requests on a "normal" set of industry standards - time is always a critical issue - wish I could be more specific but if I was I'd have to killya, jk

Is there someplace in tools/options that you know of where the "master" scale list for AutoCAD is accessed and can be edited so that scales added to the list become available in ALL drawings subsequently opened?

We turn over a lot of drawings and it would be nice to add them along the way

[Anonymous]

funny how things work out

I've long given up using the scroll bars to navigate since I began using the mouse wheel to pan and zoom

 .  .  .  I remember reading a while back under someone's tips & tricks to turn off the scroll bars just to increase the screen display workspace but never got around to it .  .  . 

As far as whether the absence of scroll bars helps to fix the viewport scaling problem .  .  .  it doesn't

I have the scroll bars turned off

using the wizard to create a new layout

set the viewport scale to 1/8" = 1' (selected it from the standard scale list)

assigned the location of the viewport on the new layout page

clicked on finish button to get out of the wizard

drew a 1" long polyline in paper space

sent it to model space

polyline measures 8' -- so far so good

seleted the viewport that was just created

changed the viewport scale using the viewport scale control in the viewport tool bar to 1/4" = 1' (selecting it from the standard scale list)

drew a 1" long polyline in paper space

sent it to model space

polyline measures 4'-0.0008" -- polyline should've measured 4'

viewport scale control can't be relied on to be accurate if it's used to modify the scale of an existing viewport

to work around the problem I can just create another layout using the wizard setting the viewport scale to the new one I need

oh well  .  .  .  at least there is some absolute viewport control elsewhere in the program that can be relied on

hopefully Autodesk will work up a patch to fix this quirk before the next release

besides, after all this I finally got around to turning off the scroll bars I don't need

[pendean]

AHA! I did not have my dimstyle set to 0.0001" to spot it. That was it.

OPTIONS command>User Preferences>Default Scale List... button is supposed to store all your entries in the Windows Registry and be available in any AutoCAD session. Any other method is file specific.

[Anonymous]

thank you THANK YOU THANK YOU

there are 2 of us here drafting and we BOTH overlooked this - was probably trying too hard to find it

I'd be interesting after a month to see how many "oddball" scales were added to the list

looking forward to the day when we won't need to add any  .  .  .  will probably run into the problem of not being able to display them all, lol

thanks again