Working Between CAD and GIS based software

[montminyj]

I've recently had the need to assign additional data fields to linework associated with pipe networks that were inserted as .shp files.  The only way I know how to do this would be to eitehr create additional blocks with attributes, or proceed with creating a pipe network based on the layout of the linework given.  Neither option seems very efficient.

Is there a quicker, or more efficient way to add useable property fields in the CAD environment? The attached .jpg image shows the additional feature properties of the line selected as imported by shp file.  I would like to add additional data fiels where apropriate.

~Jason

[civilspace]

Hi Jason,

When you say usable, what exactly do you intend to use it for?  And what data fields are you likely to use?  Also, what software is the data coming from?

[civilspace]

Off the top of my head, I would wonder if the software you're using has the capacity to export a pipe network to a LandXML format.  Alternatively, you're really dealing with a network topology, so inserting the .shp of lines, and another of points (for structures, with a field that defines the block name to insert)e, you can create a network topology using map tools and perform analysis of the network.  

I guess it also comes down to whether you're really working between, or if you're with with data from a GIS.  If you're concerned with passing data back and forth multiple times during the design process, that requires a lot of thought, but if you're just using the data from the GIS, then it should be a bit simpler, task-based approach.

[montminyj]

Useable = When exporting back to a shape file for use with modeling software (as an example SewerGEMS), the information comes in as separate data fields to work between.

Data Fields = Could be anything from pipe material, pipes diameter, inverts, or just translating the existing fields

The data could come from any software capable of assigning data fields to a shape file.  I'm looking for ways to work between the software better without taking the extra step to setup a pipe network or iteratively assigning new attributes to blocks.

[montminyj]

A good example would be if I wanted to use autocad to explode a polyline with the additional data as shown in the jpg, modify it appropriately and re-assign new data.  I know I can do this in SewerGEMS without an issue, but the specific shape file I'm dealing with requires some initial care which will work more effectively with the use of AutoCAD until modeled connectivity is more easily established.

[civilspace]

Hmm - Ok, I'm not familiar with SewerGEMS, but I'll go look it up.

[montminyj]

Thanks, from what i've worked with so far, I know I can use the Autocad plug-in for SewerGEMS to get the job done, but for future needs, I'd like to be able to skip that step when the situation dictates.

[civilspace]

Ah ok - well I think that the only real way to pass pipe network data in/out of Civil3D is using the LandXML format.  SewerCAD will import the SewerGEMS model, and output to LandXML, so that's one option if you have access to that.

Alternatively you could uset the Arc Interop extension: http://www.esri.com/library/fliers/pdfs/data-interop-formats.pdf to output to LandXML.  

Seems like there's no smooth way to utilize in Civil3D without some work.  The bi-direction connection to shapefiles that SewerGEMS can do is nice, because you can also have a bi-directional connection using the map tools, but then you're just left with Object Data rather than a true pipe network.

[montminyj]

It would benefit if there was a way to sketch out a pipe network in CAD, using polylines, then simply right click on the apropriate pollylines and begin to assign object data to each one, such as diameter, inverts, etc.  The data would not have to be useable in the CAD environment, it would simply show as data fields once exported as a shp file.  Currently the only way I know how to do this is through creating attribute blocks for each applicable pipe run.

The pipe network export to function in civil 3d is nice, but would require setting up a pipe network, which would be an iterative task if its already been provided as a model in SewerGEMS, or any other form of GIS based modelling software.

[civilspace]

Well, if it's the ability to assign object data tables and assign data to the objects that you're after, you can do with with the Map tools.  Just either use your own Object Data Table, or use the one created at import of the SewerGEMS SHP.  Then attach the OD table to the geometry, and edit away.  Then, when you MAPEXPORT to SHP, you can specify the OD tables/fields to include in the export.  

Based on your last post, I think MAP has a lot of the functionality you want.  You'd sketch out the network, attach a OD table, then click and edit the data associated with each OD table.  You definitely don't have to use just blocks to define the OD.

[Murph_Map]

Forget about the map import and export, use data connect and connect to the native shp file(s) edit the geometry as needed using standard AutoCAD edit commands, if you need to "break" a polyline use the map split function, if you want to create a new sewer line the data connect tools allow that while letting you add the new attributes field values. Need to erase a section, go ahead, want to combine a section to another section, it can do that to.  Nothing to it.

[montminyj]

The previous 2 posts appear to be what I am looking for.  Thanks for the time.  I'll adivise if there are any issues along the way. 

[ralstogj]

Hi

This maybe another option for you.

I am just get into using the Storm and Santiary Sewer Extension and it has shp import functions and then you can pass the data from

that extension into Civil3d as a pipe network. There is a quick video at this blog of the import

http://bimontherocks.typepad.com/my_weblog/2010/09/importing-shapefiles-into-autodesk-storm-and-sani...

maybe the way to go if you are just wanting an actual civil3d pipe network quickly in your drawing as I do not know of a way to

quickly go from map shp files of a pipe network to a civil3d pipe network.

The problem I have at the moment is that most GIS systems use a map base co-ordinate system and not a survey based one

so the data from the local council in the shp files has to be changed to the survey based co-odinates system. Not sure of the best way

to do this yet and how I get the information back out in shp files of the right co-ordinate system again.

Regards

Justin Ralston

[montminyj]

thanks, this looks promising as well.  Should come in handy when moving on to the construction plan phase.  You should be able to import any coordinate system into CAD that you may need, we've come across this before as it pertains to importing GIS data.  I might be off-base with what you are looking for, but check the toolspace settings in autocad, if you have the apropriate coordinate system on file, you should be able to swap it out.

[tzzzzoddhepworth4253]

a few things to add to the discussion:

Civil3D contains Map3d - use either the tool-based or task-based geospatial workspaces in 2010 or 2011, or type "MAPWSPACE" to access.

If you're working with a current .SHP file, you can edit the linework in place & modify the underlying database file of the SHP.  However, if you want to modify the data structure (add columns of data or new fields such as OD / Nominal Dia / installer / etc) you'll likely have to convert the SHP to Autodesk's native .SDF file and then "bulk copy" the SDF back into a SHP.  It's not as bad as it sounds.

You have the Map User's Guide & Tutorials included with CIvil3D- check your installation location and/or help files for a large (20mb+) pdf.....

What you want to do can be done within C3D...

[biggeorge]

Jason,  I was using a software from the FAA to start the process of converting Airport Layout Plans cad drawings into a GIS ready doc.

The only thing is I had to use their layer names.  It was designed to use as-built info.

I tested it on some of the as-built runways and aprons I had.  I created a polygons from the as-built drawings and renamed the layers to match theirs.  then I ran their program on the file and when I listed the polygons I had 4  fields at the bottom of the properties dialogue box.  I could fill this in wih info runway 9-27, tpa, 9-10-2010, etc.

that drawing when complete could be queried to bring all of the info into a gis system.

I t looked like a great thing to me, but I lost my job there.

BIGGEORGE