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What do you use for Water Network Analysis and other Pressure Pipe Analysis

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Message 1 of 16
dana.probert
2544 Views, 15 Replies

What do you use for Water Network Analysis and other Pressure Pipe Analysis


Hi Folks



I am doing some research on pressure pipe analysis workflows.



What are you using for potable water network analysis? Forcemain analysis? Other pressure transmission lines (gas, etc)?



Last time I did system and fire flow for water networks, my company had some custom spreadsheets and excell add ons that were tabular and had to have manual entry.



What might other people be working with?



Dana Probert

Autodesk

Dana Probert, P.E.
Technical Marketing Manager, Civil Engineering
Autodesk
Blog: BIM on the Rocks
Learn More About BIM for Infrastructure
15 REPLIES 15
Message 2 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: dana.probert


Haven't for some time, but I used to use Haestad
methods water cad. Very intuitive & user friendly.


--
Thanks, Joe

 

Joseph D. Bouza, P.E.
Civil 3D 2008
LDT 2008
Win XP pro
v 2002,
sp 2
hp workstation xw4600
Intel Core Duo CPU
E7200 @2.53 GHz
3 GB
RAM
NIVDIA Quadro FX 1700 (512MB)

 

The mantra of a former Flamer:

 

If you are forced to eat an Elephant, don’t complain about it; Take one
bite at a time.

 

*****************************************************************************************
In
memory of the King of Work-arounds
"The only Constant is Change".

 

"The only thing worse than training your staff, and having them leave is
-
not training your staff, and having them stay." 😮
A reminder taken
from Graphics Solution Providers' Calendar
page
*****************************************************************************************


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">


Hi Folks



I am doing some research on pressure pipe
analysis workflows.



What are you using for potable water
network analysis? Forcemain analysis? Other pressure transmission lines (gas,
etc)?



Last time I did system and fire flow for water networks,
my company had some custom spreadsheets and excell add ons that were tabular
and had to have manual entry.



What might other people be
working with?



Dana
Probert

Autodesk

Message 3 of 16
dana.probert
in reply to: dana.probert

Questions for WaterCAD (and other) users:



Tell me about how you get your data into it? What inputs does it take?



What outputs do you use?



Do you make exhibits and reports that need to be turned into agencies? Is there any information that you take back into your Civil 3D/LDT/Autocad environment?
Dana Probert, P.E.
Technical Marketing Manager, Civil Engineering
Autodesk
Blog: BIM on the Rocks
Learn More About BIM for Infrastructure
Message 4 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: dana.probert

We use Bentley Watercad XM. We typically use import a .dxf file from
AutoCAD, then input the "intelligent" linework and data in the Watercad
user interface.

I'm not an expert in Watercad by a long stretch; we have other utility
engineers who use it a lot more. I believe there are typical reports
preinstalled in Watercad that our Federal Gov't clients like to see.

As for importing back into Civil 3D etc, we do not currently do this
since Civil 3D does not have pressure pipe design / drafting
capability. The exhibits that can be printed to a color printer
(11"x17") from Watercad is usually sufficient to include in our reports.

Having said this and from a strictly plan production stand-point, I
would like to be able to have Civil 3D help me draft in water lines in
profile, including vertical bends and fittings. I know there are ways
to accomplish this through creative use of the current Pipes module, but
I would like to see an area specifically dedicated for pressure piping.
Sounds like that's what you may be investigating.

Dave

David Dixon
Clark Nexsen, Architecture & Engineering
Civil 3D 2009 / Raster Design 2009
Dell Precision T3400, XP Pro SP2, 4GB
NVidia Quadro FX 750 Dual Display
http://dca2civil3d.blogspot.com



dana.probert@autodesk.com wrote:
> Questions for WaterCAD (and other) users:
>
>
>
> Tell me about how you get your data into it? What inputs does it take?
>
>
>
> What outputs do you use?
>
>
>
> Do you make exhibits and reports that need to be turned into agencies?
> Is there any information that you take back into your Civil
> 3D/LDT/Autocad environment?
Message 5 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: dana.probert


Watercad as I recall had the ability to extract
elevation data from a LDT file but it was clunky. However, setting defaults for
fittings, various headlosses was pretty straight forward. It was NOT dat entry
Free


--
Thanks, Joe

 

Joseph D. Bouza, P.E.
Civil 3D 2008
LDT 2008
Win XP pro
v 2002,
sp 2
hp workstation xw4600
Intel Core Duo CPU
E7200 @2.53 GHz
3 GB
RAM
NIVDIA Quadro FX 1700 (512MB)

 

The mantra of a former Flamer:

 

If you are forced to eat an Elephant, don’t complain about it; Take one
bite at a time.

 

*****************************************************************************************
In
memory of the King of Work-arounds
"The only Constant is Change".

 

"The only thing worse than training your staff, and having them leave is
-
not training your staff, and having them stay." 😮
A reminder taken
from Graphics Solution Providers' Calendar
page
*****************************************************************************************


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
Questions
for WaterCAD (and other) users:



Tell me about how you get your
data into it? What inputs does it take?



What outputs do you
use?



Do you make exhibits and reports that need to be turned
into agencies? Is there any information that you take back into your Civil
3D/LDT/Autocad environment?
Message 6 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: dana.probert

I typically use WaterCAD XM version by Bentley integrated with AutoCAD.
That way I can convert my autocad entities into pipes. There is a tool
within WaterCAD to extract node elevations from a TIN surface (not working
very well for me lately though). Proposed pipe diameters need to be input
in a table form (when multiple editing) or property dialog box for
individual edits. exhibtis then are prepared color coding pipes by
diameters, pressure zones, etc.and obiously the output data we are
concerened above pressure velocities, headlosses, available fire flow, etc.
I typically use it for water distribution and tranmission systems. For
force main analysis I typically combine it with my gravity system in
SewerCAd by Bentley.

"David Dixon" wrote in message
news:6108315@discussion.autodesk.com...
We use Bentley Watercad XM. We typically use import a .dxf file from
AutoCAD, then input the "intelligent" linework and data in the Watercad
user interface.

I'm not an expert in Watercad by a long stretch; we have other utility
engineers who use it a lot more. I believe there are typical reports
preinstalled in Watercad that our Federal Gov't clients like to see.

As for importing back into Civil 3D etc, we do not currently do this
since Civil 3D does not have pressure pipe design / drafting
capability. The exhibits that can be printed to a color printer
(11"x17") from Watercad is usually sufficient to include in our reports.

Having said this and from a strictly plan production stand-point, I
would like to be able to have Civil 3D help me draft in water lines in
profile, including vertical bends and fittings. I know there are ways
to accomplish this through creative use of the current Pipes module, but
I would like to see an area specifically dedicated for pressure piping.
Sounds like that's what you may be investigating.

Dave

David Dixon
Clark Nexsen, Architecture & Engineering
Civil 3D 2009 / Raster Design 2009
Dell Precision T3400, XP Pro SP2, 4GB
NVidia Quadro FX 750 Dual Display
http://dca2civil3d.blogspot.com



dana.probert@autodesk.com wrote:
> Questions for WaterCAD (and other) users:
>
>
>
> Tell me about how you get your data into it? What inputs does it take?
>
>
>
> What outputs do you use?
>
>
>
> Do you make exhibits and reports that need to be turned into agencies?
> Is there any information that you take back into your Civil
> 3D/LDT/Autocad environment?
Message 7 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: dana.probert

yes, that's great. our version is the standalone version of Watercad.
We do not own the version that works within ACAD.

fcobob wrote:
> I typically use WaterCAD XM version by Bentley integrated with AutoCAD.
> That way I can convert my autocad entities into pipes. There is a tool
> within WaterCAD to extract node elevations from a TIN surface (not working
> very well for me lately though). Proposed pipe diameters need to be input
> in a table form (when multiple editing) or property dialog box for
> individual edits. exhibtis then are prepared color coding pipes by
> diameters, pressure zones, etc.and obiously the output data we are
> concerened above pressure velocities, headlosses, available fire flow, etc.
> I typically use it for water distribution and tranmission systems. For
> force main analysis I typically combine it with my gravity system in
> SewerCAd by Bentley.
>
> "David Dixon" wrote in message
> news:6108315@discussion.autodesk.com...
> We use Bentley Watercad XM. We typically use import a .dxf file from
> AutoCAD, then input the "intelligent" linework and data in the Watercad
> user interface.
>
> I'm not an expert in Watercad by a long stretch; we have other utility
> engineers who use it a lot more. I believe there are typical reports
> preinstalled in Watercad that our Federal Gov't clients like to see.
>
> As for importing back into Civil 3D etc, we do not currently do this
> since Civil 3D does not have pressure pipe design / drafting
> capability. The exhibits that can be printed to a color printer
> (11"x17") from Watercad is usually sufficient to include in our reports.
>
> Having said this and from a strictly plan production stand-point, I
> would like to be able to have Civil 3D help me draft in water lines in
> profile, including vertical bends and fittings. I know there are ways
> to accomplish this through creative use of the current Pipes module, but
> I would like to see an area specifically dedicated for pressure piping.
> Sounds like that's what you may be investigating.
>
> Dave
>
> David Dixon
> Clark Nexsen, Architecture & Engineering
> Civil 3D 2009 / Raster Design 2009
> Dell Precision T3400, XP Pro SP2, 4GB
> NVidia Quadro FX 750 Dual Display
> http://dca2civil3d.blogspot.com
>
>
>
> dana.probert@autodesk.com wrote:
>
>> Questions for WaterCAD (and other) users:
>>
>>
>>
>> Tell me about how you get your data into it? What inputs does it take?
>>
>>
>>
>> What outputs do you use?
>>
>>
>>
>> Do you make exhibits and reports that need to be turned into agencies?
>> Is there any information that you take back into your Civil
>> 3D/LDT/Autocad environment?
>>
Message 8 of 16


Create 3DPolylines of the pipe network. Drape them on the surface, then lower 3' or what ever distance is required. Export to SHP file and import the SHP file into WaterCAD.

Christopher

http://blog.civil3dreminders.com/

http://style.civil3dreminders.com/

Civil Reminders
http://blog.civil3dreminders.com/
http://www.CivilReminders.com/
Alumni
Message 9 of 16
mspatz
in reply to: dana.probert

We use WaterCAD and DXF to import.

Mark Spatz, P.E.
Herbert, Rowland & Grubic, Inc.
Harrisburg, PA
Message 10 of 16
ralstogj
in reply to: dana.probert

We use mike urban

http://www.dhigroup.com/Software/Urban/MIKEURBAN/Details/WaterDistribution.aspx

which takes dxf and shp or text file input.

Regards

Justin
Regards

Justin Ralston
http://c3dxtreme.blogspot.com/
Message 11 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: dana.probert


You're just full of amazing stuff, man.  What
the H?  You're not really one person are you?  Legion.


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">


Create 3DPolylines of the pipe network. Drape them on the surface, then
lower 3' or what ever distance is required. Export to SHP file and import the
SHP file into
WaterCAD.

Christopher

http://blog.civil3dreminders.com/

http://style.civil3dreminders.com/

Message 12 of 16

Actually I did that method once, didn't do a post and then forgot how I got the elevation to come in for the node. The method still brings in the linework and makes nodes and pipes and someday when I have to do a subdivision again I'll figure out how to get the elevation to come in with the node and do a post about it. It's still faster than importing a DXF and then tracing over it. Although we are using an older version of WaterCAD and there may have been some improvements to pull information from the DXF.

I'm one person who hates to do things manually when the computer can automate the tasks.

Christopher

http://blog.civil3dreminders.com/

http://style.civil3dreminders.com/
Civil Reminders
http://blog.civil3dreminders.com/
http://www.CivilReminders.com/
Alumni
Message 13 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: dana.probert

Chris - you're not the only one who hates doing things manually when the
computer or program should automate the tasks!

Matthew Anderson, PE



Civil3DReminders.com wrote:
> Actually I did that method once, didn't do a post and then forgot how
> I got the elevation to come in for the node. The method still brings
> in the linework and makes nodes and pipes and someday when I have to
> do a subdivision again I'll figure out how to get the elevation to
> come in with the node and do a post about it. It's still faster than
> importing a DXF and then tracing over it. Although we are using an
> older version of WaterCAD and there may have been some improvements to
> pull information from the DXF.
>
> I'm one person who hates to do things manually when the computer can
> automate the tasks.
>
> Christopher
>
> http://blog.civil3dreminders..com/
>
> http://style.civil3dreminders.com/
Message 14 of 16
nkg2
in reply to: dana.probert


Dana -



Can you tell us whether or not Civil 3D will incorporate a haydraulic analysis tool and if so do you have a time frame? I am about to spend some money on WaterCAD and SewerCAD and before I drop some coin, I would really like to know what you know. It would be swell if you guys did but if not I understand too.



On a side note, WaterGEMS from Bentley supports AutoCAD but not Civil3D, is it because of how new Civil3D is and AutoDesk does not share sensitive program language or is Bentley trying to pull away from AutoDesk?



Thank you in advance!

***Viewer/Reader Discretion is Advised***
Autodesk 2022- Architectural, Engineering and Construction Subscription & Infraworks
Windows 10 Professional, x64, Microsoft Surface Pro 3
Message 15 of 16
drazen-ars
in reply to: dana.probert

Hi,

We made application Hydra on top of Civil 3D/AutoCAD which can automatically and intuitively generate all necessary data for Epanet. Solution is widely used in Eastern and Central Europe. Can communicate through LandXML format.

Best regards,

Drazen Galic
StudioARS Croatia
www.studioars.com
d dot galic at
Message 16 of 16

Force mains, we typically use an Excel spreadsheet setup for Hazen Williams. Get your equivalent lengths in each size, plug it in and you are done.

For drinking water distribution, we will typically use EPANet.

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