Trim/Extend to Point Marker?

[seattlesurvey]

Is there a setting that will allow me to trim/extend linework to a point marker?  It's a cosmetic thing, but back in LDD (I know, I know...) we liked to trim utility linework to utility features - it could allow the features stand out.  In C3D, the point markers aren't 'seen' that way (at least in their present configuration).

Does anyone have any insight on this?

Thanks.

[Sinc]

It's generally considered bad practice to trim linework behind symbols, because it does things like break continuous figures and create lines that don't have correct lengths.  That causes more problems for things like lot lines, but it can apply in other situations as well.

A better solution is to add wipeouts to the symbols.

However, there is a bug in Civil 3D in this regard.  Whenever blocks are used in C3D Point Styles, the draw order of items within the blocks is ignored.  That means you have to create your wipeout first, before the other linework in your symbols.  But of course, it's hard to create a wipeout until you draw the rest of the symbol, and know where to put the wipeout.

So what I usually do is (in the block editor) create my symbol linework.  Then I'll create my wipeout the way I want it.  Then I'll copy all the original symbol linework, and then delete the original linework I just copied.  This makes the wipeout display correctly when used in C3D Point Styles.

[seattlesurvey]

Thanks - good insights.  Wipeouts sound like a good, clean option (despite having to recreate all of our marker blocks).  We might consider doing that soon if nothing else seems like it'll work.

For the present, though, I'm still wondering about my original question - is there no way to trim/extend to point markers?  It may be 'bad practice,' but my boss wants to see the located utilities trimmed to the appropriate features.

Again, thanks.

[Sinc]

Have you tried the TRIM and EXTEND commands...?

I just tried them, and they worked, triming lines to symbols in C3D Cogo Points.

[seattlesurvey]

{laughing}  Of course I had, but that's what wasn't working.  I can invoke those commands, and select the point marker as the cutting edge, but when I try to trim or extend a line to it, nothing happens.

I wonder what's different in our set-up here. ?

Thanks for trying it.  But now you've really got me wondering.  I wonder if it's a point style setting that's influencing things...

[Adam_Farnsworth]

Just thinking out loud here, but maybe it has something to do with lines/points at different elevations?

[seattlesurvey]

Ya know, I bet you're right.  Our points do come in at elevation.  Thanks for throwing that out there - I think that's it.

So here's a hi-jack thread question:  what setting does one use in the point style to have points come in at zero elevation (flattened?), yet still retain whatever property they need to allow 3dplines to snap to their shot elevations?

Thanks for your help!

[seattlesurvey]

So I just edited a point style:  3D Geometry tab ... Point Display Mode, set this to Flatten Points to Elevation, with the Point Elevation set to 0.00'.  Applied the change, but still cannot trim to this marker.

When I select a point that uses this newly-edited point style, its Properties still show a shot elevation.  Shouldn't the elevation show as 0.00'?

I also tried modifying my All Points point group, setting a Point Elevation Override to 0.00'.  This did change the point elevation to 0.00' in Properties, but I still couldn't trim to the point marker.

So all is not as clear as I thought.

Still taking comments...

[Sinc]

Are your utility lines Survey Figures or Feature Lines, by chance...?

I was still unable to reproduce your issue, and could always TRIM or EXTEND linework to symbols, no matter how I configured the Cogo Points.  But then I tried a SURVEY FIGURE...

The normal TRIM and EXTEND commands don't work on Survey Figures or Feature Lines.  And there's a special version of TRIM called TRIMFEATURES that works on Survey Figures and Polylines, but will not allow Cogo Point markers to be used as a cutting edge.

You could get around this in various ways.  One option would be to explode your utility lines into normal polylines, then use the standard TRIM or EXTEND commands.  Or you could try hand-editing your figures, manually creating the gaps without being able to select the symbols as your cutting edge.  A better option might be to redefine your symbols with wipeouts in them.

[seattlesurvey]

Thanks Sinc.  My current workflow is to explode the survey figures into 3d polylines, do some editing of those, copy those that are breaklines into my surface breakline layer, then convert all of the 3d polys into 2d polys and set the elevations to zero via their Properties.

So, the short answer is:  these are 2d polylines I'm trying to trim/extend.

I appreciate hearing what happens in your environment; it's helping me narrow down what's going on here.

[seattlesurvey · Accepted solution]

We were able to restore trim/extend functions to our point markers by configuring our point styles to use a uniform fixed scale.

Our Size Option is set to 'Use fixed scale", and our Fixed Scale was previously set to X: 20, Y:20, Z:1.  Now they are all set to 20.  This has resolved our trim/extend issue.

Thanks to all who took the time to offer suggestions.