Paperspace rotation and text

[allywhite666]

Hello everyone,

I am trying to rotate my drawing in paperspace only so it will fit inside my titleblock at the scale that I want. I was able to do this visually by clicking inside my viewport and typing dview then tw (twist). This works great but is there any way to make the cogo points (and/or text) rotate so they are readable at 90 degrees, when I rotate the drawing they stay in the original orientation to the model space. I want model space to stay as it was with north pointing up and cogo points/text point 90 deg. and paperspace to twist the way I want it and the cogo pointss/text point 90 deg for the viewer.

Any help would be appreciated.

[sboon]

You used DVIEW - Twist to rotate the viewpoint in your paperspace view.  If you want to export C3D data from modelspace and have it match that rotation then you should use DVIEW again to twist your modelspace view before exporting the drawing to ACad.

Steve
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[allywhite666]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for replying.

Not sure what you mean use DVIEW again, if you mean in model and not the viewport then this will change the model which I want it to remain as it is, the C3D data is just blocks now as I exploded them.

[sboon]

You'll have to go back to the original C3D drawing, rotate the modelspace view to suit and then export it again.  If you're careful you should be able to cut and paste the exploded point blocks from the second export file into the first one.

Steve
Please use the Accept as Solution or Kudo buttons when appropriate

[allywhite666]

Hi Steve,

I see what you are trying to do but I tried this and it didn't work. In C3D exploding does the same thing as in Autocad, copying and trying to paste into paper space won't work it just makes a mess with points on top of points. But thanks for trying.

[Joe-Bouza]

I'll try and say it a different way.

It behooves you to have the same rotation in model space as you want in your paper space view port.

That way when you label the plan all the labels are oriented the way you want. That goes for cogo point, label styles and all your mtext labels in the drawing. Then there is no need to explode cogo points and try to get them to match.

When I know how my sheet view is going to look - I set it in MS>> save the view>> then restore it in PS vport, then I know I am working in the same universe as I create the plan. A little pre-planning with label style and annotative text will make your plan more flexible if the views should change.

I understand your experience level is not that high. Its higher than you give yourself credit for, otherwise you would not even have come to this DG looking for answers. The answer to everyone of your questions is yes, but the scope of the answers is beyond the ability of a posting to fully instruct you as to accomplish. As peers we offer our experiences and hopefully you can find direction in it.

Take a deep breadth, break down your questions and look into the help files for acad (block/ attribute rotation) and the civil3d tutorials. And keeping coming back to "discuss" things. This is not to say don't ask "How to questions", I do all the time. But sometimes you have to take like a fledgling from the nest and carry the experience with you so you can answer things for your self.

You'll do fine.

[allywhite666]

Hello Joe,

Thank you for taking the time to respond.

Yes I have been reading as much as I can on how to solve this problem but have not yet got the solution that I want. Thanks to your help I know how to do it as civil points but they must be exploded for my client.

I could continue to explode them down to separate entities, this can be done by exporting as a number of people have suggested, but I would rather have the marker and label as a block so they are together.

When the cogo point is created it must set the block to stay the same rotation in both views, finding this setting may solve my problem so as when the cogo point is made, the block its self can be set to "View" like the cogo point which it is inside.

If it is possible to do a dview twist to the lines and have them look different in model space and the paper space view port, then the points should rotate around their base point also, after all some of the text in the example I attached previously rotated correctly, maybe this will be updated in the next autocad release so it is simple to do.

In the meantime I will keep looking for a solution.

[Joe-Bouza]

I guess I am puzzled to why you have to have MS oriented different then PS. Best practices suggest single layout per file so even multiple sheets can be synced as I suggested then you problem no longer exist.

[allywhite666]

Hi Joe, thanks again for replying.

I guess I have been doing things wrong, this is how I have been doing my drawings-

1. Draw everything in MS.

2. Switch to PS, where I already have my viewport created around the titleblock.

3. Make the view port active and set the scale that best fits.

4. DView Twist IF the drawing needs it to fit better and rescale if necessary (I always keep north up the page if I can, but can't always)

5. Now there is the MS which is correctly north and can be worked on by the client and PS which is set up for printing.

Can you please tell me If there is a better way, this would help me greatly. 🙂

When you do your drawings do you ever rotate or do you keep north up, and if you rotate do you just rotate the whole drawing in MS so north is no longer up?

[Joe-Bouza]

the way of doing things in cad is very personalized and the right way is usually defined as the right way for the individual.

When I tell you something its not necesarilly "The Right way" but a way that works for me.

Now, for me, If I had to work on a plan in MS and print in PS I try to set my MS view the same orientation as the printed view ( as I explained a couple of threds up) This only makes sense to me since then I have 100% confidence in the annotation of the plan and no one will get confused switching tabs. Others may not agree but I would debate the case.

MS views can be rotated just as PS views can. I determine what the sheet view wants to be twist MS ands go to work then when I go to print there are no surprises (hopefully) The method is up to the users , DVIEW or UCS, I care not to opin since you could print reems and reems of paper from this DG over the heated debated.

Which ever method you use, having MS an PS synced will save your the trouble you experienced in this post. Wouldn't you agree.

The method you outline is perfectly acceptable to 100 % of the reader here. I personally would move step 4 up a few clicks to setp one

[allywhite666]

@ joe.

Thank you so much for your help.

I think what you said is probably the best solution.

I just tried Dview Twist in MS and then went to PS but the PS stays with north up and isn't twisted. Is there a setting to make the viewport that I have in my template follow the MS?

[allywhite666]

I know that annotative text can be made to "match orientation to layout", so I thought maybe if I create a style and make it annotative and select "match text orientation to layout" then set the cogo points to use this style that when I explode the point into a block this would be annotative but this did not work. Even if I explode it down to basic text I still have to manually change annotation to yes in properties. The blocks that are left after exploding a cogo point are different to a normal block that I make, but if I can change them to annotative then the problem would be solved.

[Joe-Bouza]

Your welcome.

I use :save a modelspace view an retore it in the vport, but I use UCS to set my views and I am not well versed with DVIEW. Saving the view is works the same.

[Cadguru42]

Just a little side note about this. Autodesk seems to think twisting the viewport with UCS is the prefered method as that's what the Plan Production tools seem to use. 

I've tried using DVIEW twist, but I have trouble getting it to work the way I want it. So, I leave model space alone and when I need to label features, I do it through the viewport that was twisted using UCS / Plan. I've thought about keeping the proposed layout just a clean drawing without labels and XREF'ing it into another drawing(s) for labeling purposes, but I've found that since we usually only have one or two match lines for our projects I just live with the model space having a bunch of labels. 

EDIT: Well, now that I look at a viewport created from the PP system it might be DVIEW with twist applied. LOL. 

[Joe-Bouza]

Personally, I feel like an 80 year old man with an Xbox game controller in my hand trying to use DVIEW twist

[susanhunter1]

Quick tricks for Dview twist:

1. In unrotated  paper space, trace a line from over the object in your model that you want to be orthogonal in your in your sheet, e.g., a plan & profile sheet along a road.  If it's a winding object, just draw it more or less down the center.

2. Use the changespace command to move your line into the viewport model space within the sheet. Zoom to the area of your model that you want on the sheet. Scale your viewport.

3. Start Dview command, twist and there will be a prompt to pick an object. Pick the line and complete the prompts or pick 2 points, one on the the right side and the second one on the left, complete the command. Remember that if you drew the line at a certain angle, for example 30 degrees, the twist needs to be the reciprocal of that angle around your azimuth circle. Use Viewtwist to check it. If you want, reset the twist to the closest degree, just to keep things tidy.

4. If all is ok, erase your dummy line. Don't forget to do this or a F.O. will show up in the drawing later-usually on some odd layer.

5. Don't rotate your real model with dview. Then you have to rotate profiles and sections when bringing them into viewports. The problem with putting a different UCS on different things is that you end up resetting World UCS all the time.

6. Don't let this spoil your weekend. Cheers.

[allywhite666]

Thank you all for your input.

For those who do not like the feel of Dview Twist there is a lisp file that I found on these forums, TW.lsp, that makes it simple and you can juts select a line in your drawing to rotate to 90deg (I can't find the post again but if you search you will come across it).

Personally I don't care which method I use to rotate as long as those blocks sit at 90deg in PS AND MS but I think this is not achievable and I am hoping they fix this in the next release and make it simple to have the MS and a viewport in PS look perfect.