Manipulating Point Groups/Datum/Alignment

[Jon-Boy]

Hi,
Im using C3D and having problems manipulating point groups.
I would like to move the points and alter the shown datum level by a set amount.
i have had varying degrees of success with this as on some drawings it will work and then frustratingly if i were to open a different drawing but not change any settings it wont work!!!

I would attach a word document with two print screens showing a survey. But i cannot seem to attach any files to this site even though its only a tiny file size.
The only difference i can see is the little icons to the left of the point number within the prospector are different.

Is this a simple case of a setting being different within each drawings?

Please help, I`m a noobie to this site and C3D 2007, but have years experience on LDT 2004 and many other CAD systems, which at the moment doesn`t seem to be helping at all !!!!!!!!!!

Cheers
John

[Anonymous]

Jon-Boy wrote:

> I would attach a word document with two print screens showing a
> survey. But i cannot seem to attach any files to this site even
> though its only a tiny file size. The only difference i can see is
> the little icons to the left of the point number within the
> prospector are different.

Little icon is different? Could this perchance mean that the point is
locked???

--
Jason Hickey

Civil 3D 2007, SP3
Dell Precision M70
2 GIG RAM, 256 MB nVidia Quadro FX Go1400
Intel Centrino 2 gHz Processor

www.civil3d.com

[Jon-Boy]

Cheers for your reply.
this is so difficult to explain without being able to attatch an image.
the points arent locked, ie there isnt an extra image of a pen with a red circle crossing it out. but its the little icon to the left of that which has changed.
in the drawing where im able to manipulate the points this icon looks like a diamond with its centre missing, ie the symbol which appears next to point groups in the prospector.

when i cant alter the points the symbol looks like a square divided into quarters with the upper and lower segments being white and the segments to the left and the right being coloured in blue.

as i said its tricky to explain without being able to attach anything, but hopefully you get the jist?!?!?!?!

cheers
John Message was edited by: Jon-Boy

[Anonymous]

I believe the points you are having trouble editing are survey points, brought in through a survey database. These you won't be able to edit from the Prospector or on the screen (change datum, location, etc.). The points with the regular symbol you can edit, which you have already seen. I've attached a screenshot of my Prospector that has some survey points and "regular" points to show the difference in the symbols, just to make sure we're all talking about the same things here.

Hope that helps,
Russ

[Jon-Boy]

Hi Rus,
thanks for attaching the screen shot,
the top two points in your prospecter are the type i cannot edit and the other two are the type i can edit.

how do i convert the survey points into normal editable points without losing their link to the database?

Many thanks
John

[Anonymous]

I exported the survey points as an ASCII TXT file. Then Removed the survey points from the drawing (In the Survey tab, open the survey database, right-click on Survey Points and choose Points - Remove from Drawing). Then Import the TXT file. There may be an easier, more direct way, but that was the most obvious when I've done it before.

Russ

[Jon-Boy]

Cheers Rus for your prompt reply,
i will give that a go, and hopefully it should make my life easier!
Many thanks again
John

[Anonymous]

HI jon boy, still having trouble getting this great survey software to work I see, do what the autocad boys say & 'go on a course'

[Anonymous]

Jon-Boy wrote:
> Cheers Rus for your prompt reply,
> i will give that a go, and hopefully it should make my life easier!
> Many thanks again
> John

Be careful, John - if you export and import, they lose their link to the
survey database.

Why not edit them in the survey toolspace? There should be an
associated fieldbook and observations - edit those observations. Once
you export the points and reimport them so that you can edit them,
you've just destroyed the very reason for the existence of the survey
database.

--
Jason Hickey

Civil 3D 2007, SP3
Dell Precision M70
2 GIG RAM, 256 MB nVidia Quadro FX Go1400
Intel Centrino 2 gHz Processor

www.civil3d.com

[Jon-Boy]

Jason,
when you say edit them in the survey data base does this mean that if i need to alter the level of all my points by 0.245m then i will have to go through all of my target heights one by one and work out what the new level will be manually and then input it into the appropriate box????
could you please tell me what the edit datum command is for then?
and how is it possible to align survey points in the drawing?

I dont mean to sound rude or facetious, just getting very frustrated with what is supposed to be; Qoute from the Autodesk website:
"Autodesk Civil 3D streamlines your field-to-office processes using survey communication, data transfer, analysis, reduction, and automated drafting. Now Civil 3D has you covered, from initial survey through to final plans."

hmmmmmm....................... no comment

John

[Anonymous]

Jon-Boy wrote:
> Jason, when you say edit them in the survey data base does this mean
> that if i need to alter the level of all my points by 0.245m then i
> will have to go through all of my target heights one by one and work
> out what the new level will be manually and then input it into the
> appropriate box???? could you please tell me what the edit datum
> command is for then? and how is it possible to align survey points in
> the drawing?
>
> I dont mean to sound rude or facetious, just getting very frustrated
> with what is supposed to be; Qoute from the Autodesk website:
> "Autodesk Civil 3D streamlines your field-to-office processes using
> survey communication, data transfer, analysis, reduction, and
> automated drafting. Now Civil 3D has you covered, from initial survey
> through to final plans."
>
> hmmmmmm....................... no comment

I'll join you in your "no comment" - I like things to be easier rather
than harder. However, all isn't quite lost...this extension should be
on the Civil Engineering Community Site -
http://www.civil3d.com/index.php/2007/02/new-survey-extension-available-for-civil-3d/#more-584

A quote from that article:

The purpose of this command is to perform a simple translation of a
selected survey network, given a base point, rotation angle, a
destination point, and a change in elevation (optional).

Looks like what you wanted - edit datum as well as rotation. I'll be
away from an internet connection for most of today (and tonight) but if
you can't find it, let me know and I'll try to see if I can find it to
email to you - I think I'm using the third or fourth revision of the
extension.



--
Jason Hickey

Civil 3D 2007, SP3
Dell Precision M70
2 GIG RAM, 256 MB nVidia Quadro FX Go1400
Intel Centrino 2 gHz Processor

www.civil3d.com

[Jon-Boy]

Many thanks Jason,
that would appear to be a very usefull tool indeed.
as i say, apologies for sounding abit rude.

cheers
John

[Nrhoads]

If you do not care about the "link" to the survey database, you can create a point group (I call it DELETE) and "include all points" in it. Right-click on the group and "Delete Points", the points in this group. Then UNDO it. Next, delete the point group itself (Right-click on the group and "Delete"), and update the point groups.
You can now edit the points in toolspace. It sounds cumbersome but it only takes a second!!!

[Jon-Boy]

Nrhoads,
we found a similar thing here, purely by accident...
i found that if you explode your survey points then insert them back into the drawing and update it, then UNDO everything you have just done then it allows you to edit the points but retains them within the point group.
it seems so bizzare that it alters them and allows you to edit them after you explode but then undo?

although ive got to say that the link Jason supplied has allowed us to edit points whilst keeping them as survey points.
Cheers
John Message was edited by: Jon-Boy