Cross Gutters and Spandrels with the Intersection Wizard

[jonathan]

Any one have any opinions or tips on using the Intersection Wizard to create an intersection and then editing it to incorporate a spandrel or am I better of not even using the wizard and creating the spandrel from feature lines/alignments?

[publicworksengineer]

Better off not using the "wizard".

In my opinion the "wizard" is only useful in the most simplistic cases, most often seen in product demonstrations.

That aside the functionality is there to create intersections with cross gutters and spandrels.

[Joe-Bouza]

Your nomenclature is unfamiliar to me, althought I know the words Im not sure what you mean by cross gutters and spandrels?

[publicworksengineer]

Google: "San Diego Regional Standard Drawings", Drawing G-12

Not that I am anywhere near San Diego myself...

[jonathan]

The San Diego detail, or variations thereof, is bacally the goal.

[Joe-Bouza]

Ok. Thats what I thought it was: a concrete valley gutter. I presume the spandrel is the curb return. Why is this so difficult to create with the wizzard?

Wouldn't an alignment for the flow path get you what you want? Holding the primary road crown?

[publicworksengineer]

Take a look at the detail. Assuming you have radial sampling of an assembly along the curb return, the wizard would not only need to target and edge offset and elevation (the extension of the primary road shoulder) but also intermediate ones as the sample his the flow lines in the gutter and spandrel. The assembly would need to have dynamic intermediate grade brakes if using the wizard.

[sboon]

An interesting problem.  I think I can see a way that it could be done.

Build outward from the two centerlines to the red marked lines using normal lane subs.  The profile and superelevation parameters of the side road would have to be adjusted to form the gutter across the intersection and transition to normal crown at the ends of the side road curb returns.  Extract the edge of pavement featurelines at the red lines on the sketch.  For the returns I would use an assembly that starts at the face of the curb and links across to the extracted featureline.  Then it uses a generic pavement sub to link horizontally and vertically back to a featureline representing the flowline, followed by another one to connect back to the alignment and profile at the curb face.

BTW: The wizard would be useful here to create the necessary offset alignments, curb return alignments and profiles.

[sboon]

It took a while but I've been able to make it work.  I used the wizard to create the offset alignments and curb return alignments, and deleted the pieces I didn't need.  Then I created the assemblies and the corridors.

The file is too large for uploading.  If anyone wants a copy then PM me and I'll post it to Dropbox or somewhere else.

[publicworksengineer]

Nice post Steve. +1 for you.

[jonathan]

Great Job Steve, especially being able to incorporate the intersection wizard.  I just PM'd you so hopefully the dwg will answer most of my questions, but in the meantime perhaps you could clear things up a bit.  I follow your procedure up to "Then it uses a generic pavement sub to link horizontally and vertically back to a featureline representing the flowline" could you elaborate for somewhat of a intersection corridor noob.

[sboon]

Typically with an assembly you start at the design alignment / profile and work outward to the left or right.  In my process what happens is that the assembly uses the LinkOffsetAndElevation to move left, to the edge of pavement from the other corridor.  I then have two ConditionalHorizontal subs.  One of them, if it locates the F/L representing the flowline, has a generic pavement sub with it's outside edge tied to that F/L horizontally and vertically.  Then there is a second generic pavement sub which is tied to the alignment and profile that the assembly started from at the curb line.  The other ConditionalHorizontal works only if the F/L cannot be found.  In that case it uses a single pavement sub all the way to the curb.

For the picture I've turned on the LinkOffsetAndElevation, but in the finished version it's not visible.

[jmayo-EE]

Nice work as always Steve.

May I have a peak. johnmATconklinassociatesDOTcom

[sboon]

No problem John - pick any one you like from the attachment.  Please excuse the dead bugs however

[rebeccac]

Hello.  I realize this post is very old, but do you still have this drawing to share with others?

[jonathan]

Here it is.



Jonathan Guzman P.L.S.

Survey Department Manager

*Fomotor Engineering*

225 South Civic Drive

Suite 1-5

Palm Springs CA, 92262

Ph. (760) 323-1842

Fax (760) 323-1742

[CesarCarrillo3157]

I am running into similar situation. If you could share how you handled this that would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Cesar

[ssims]

I realize this post is old and I am running into the same situation, would you be able to provide the file used so I can reference it? 

[sboon]

It's been quite a while but every now and then I get a message asking about this one.  The original drawing was too large for the forum site back then and it's long gone, so I've recreated a modern version. 

Newer features within Civil 3d allow for some improvements, like dynamic links to the lane edge feature lines, and a superelevation view, so that people can see how that is being used to match the cross slope of the east-west road to the profile of the north-south alignment.  I've also refined my technique for linking corridors to each other, by setting the default frequencies to 1000m but also forcing curb corridor sections at points to match the lanes corridor.

Steve
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