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Big problem with GeoMap in 2014 Civil 3D

15 REPLIES 15
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Message 1 of 16
Jasono2009
4210 Views, 15 Replies

Big problem with GeoMap in 2014 Civil 3D

I have a project that lies within a Minnesota County Coordinate System (Chisago County NAD83 US Feet, HARN Adj.) and the Geomap image is miles off! Wow.

 

Anyone else have projection problems with this false Google Earth substitute? Closed circuit to Autodesk: Bring Google Earth back NOW!

15 REPLIES 15
Message 2 of 16
mathewkol
in reply to: Jasono2009

[...Bring Google Earth back NOW!...]

 

LOL.  They can bring it back, but you're going to spend more for your Civil 3D licenses due to those pesky licensing fees Google will charge for use of the data.

Matt Kolberg
SolidCAD Professional Services
http://www.solidcad.ca /
Message 3 of 16
sboon
in reply to: mathewkol

You would be better off asking Google why they don't provide this functionality within their own software.  It would seem to be simple enough for them to include routines within GE Pro for exporting georeferenced images and surface data in a point cloud format.

 

Steve
Please use the Accept as Solution or Kudo buttons when appropriate

Steve
Expert Elite Alumnus
Message 4 of 16

Hi Jason,

I have created a screenshot after following your steps, can you confirm that you get the same result in the Geographic Location Map Window?
http://screencast.com/t/GZ4UQEd6umnj



Karsten Saenger
Message 5 of 16
Jasono2009
in reply to: sboon

No, I don't need to ask Google. Why can't Autodesk test their product before release?
Message 6 of 16

Karsten,

 

I do not know how to get to the dialogue you showed in the screenshot, but your coordinate system is defined as Chisago County, yet your marker is in Isanti County. So yes, there is defnitely a problem.

 

Please note that Chisago & Isanti Counties have separately named coordinate systems, yet share the same geoid and datum. In other words, if you are working in one, you can convert to the other with zero difference in coordinate value. Their scale factors are the same. This fact can be verified using MNDOT's MNCON coordinate conversion software (and I have verified the same in the field).

 

I also tested Geomap against survey grade LiDAR imagery on the northern tip of Vancouver Island (UTM Zone 9, NAD83, meters), and the Geomap deviated 55m (180 feet) from the LiDAR imagery.

 

Another test in New Mexico State Plane Central revealed significant differences against survey grade data (about 200 feet or so).

 

Jason

Message 7 of 16

Hi Jason,

please see following screencast that shows how I opened the map window:
http://screencast.com/t/uOxT6oFH

The actual workflow is:
1. Assign a coordinate system to your drawing.
2. Set the geo location
-> the geo location marker jumps to the middle point of the minimum and maximum longitude/latitude
-> it is not an exact location - how should it know the exact location?
3. Take the red marker in the map a mark an exact location.
4. Select the merker in your drawing a drag it to the same location.
-> Now you have the map correctly referenced to your drawing.


Karsten.



Karsten Saenger
Message 8 of 16

Thanks Karsten, I will try the workflow you provided. A question I have is why does one need to set the geographic location? As long as my coordinate system is assigned it is georeferenced, by definition it has definite latitude/longitude assigned to any County/State/UTM, coordinate. Seems like an extra step.
Message 9 of 16
fcernst
in reply to: Jasono2009

I have the same questions. I haven't used GEOMAP but I want to look into it now.

 

1) Why wouldn't a georeferenced image, say from the USGS that is located on State Plane have to be moved manually?

 

2) Is GEOMAP coming from the same service as the Bing Basejump service we access through Map > Data Connect, or is this a totally different service?

 

I do like the ability to easily move the image a bit since most of our survey is on ground.



Fred Ernst, PE
C3D 2024
Ernst Engineering
www.ernstengineering.com
Message 10 of 16
fcernst
in reply to: Karsten.Saenger

I don't see a Location panel off my Insert tab like it says here in the Help. How do I get the "Location" panel to appear?

 

Capture.JPG



Fred Ernst, PE
C3D 2024
Ernst Engineering
www.ernstengineering.com
Message 11 of 16
fcernst
in reply to: Jasono2009

 

This is the best I could get after a few tries of moving the marker around in the middle of this 25 acre site that uses a local coordinate system in Colorado Springs. I tried to pick a common PCR...not very impressive so far.

 

Capture.JPG



Fred Ernst, PE
C3D 2024
Ernst Engineering
www.ernstengineering.com
Message 12 of 16
Jasono2009
in reply to: fcernst

Fred, I'm feeling your pain. Having similar results here - just a very shoddy product at this point. This is a downgrade from Google Earth. Autodesk needs to return Google Earth to the fold by next release or time to look for expensive software elsewhere.

Message 13 of 16
fcernst
in reply to: Jasono2009

FYI:

 

Capture.JPG



Fred Ernst, PE
C3D 2024
Ernst Engineering
www.ernstengineering.com
Message 14 of 16
MKearney028
in reply to: fcernst

I know this is an old thread, but it's the first one that pops up in a google search regarding the geomap issue. I was (am) having the same problem with any drawings, including my state delivered template, that were created in AutoCAD 2012. The solution is annoying but simple. Use the command GEOREMOVE to remove the coordinate system and then just reset it. I don't know what happened between the two versions, but that seems to solve my problem every time. This may be a solution for others as well.

 

I do have to give credit to Don Quinn over at Eagle Point for helping me out with this one.

Message 15 of 16
Cadguru42
in reply to: fcernst


@fcernst wrote:

 

This is the best I could get after a few tries of moving the marker around in the middle of this 25 acre site that uses a local coordinate system in Colorado Springs. I tried to pick a common PCR...not very impressive so far.

 

Capture.JPG


I always assumed that the Google Earth and Bing aerials aren't orthorectified, which can result in strange scaling issues such as the one you posted.

C3D 2022-2024
Windows 10 Pro
32GB RAM
Message 16 of 16
jggerth1
in reply to: Cadguru42

FWIW -- I had occasions with multiple miles of differece between GeoMaps and Florida State Plane survey drawings.  Using civil3d 2014.

 

C3D 2015 put the imagery in a 'more correct' location, but the best option was to use FDOT aerials.

 

2015 Geomaps also seem to have (some times) resolution degradattion when capturing an area to print.  Not everywhere, but it's been a discussion item on these boards before.

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